Boots & Sabers

The blogging will continue until morale improves...


Everything but tech support.

0956, 12 Mar 20

Vast Majority of People Recover from Coronovirus Just Fine


SEATTLE (AP) — Amid all the fears, quarantines and stockpiling of food, it has been easy to ignore the fact that more than 60,000 people have recovered from the coronavirus spreading around the globe.

The disease can cause varying degrees of illness and is especially troublesome for older adults and people with existing health problems, who are at risk of severe effects, including pneumonia. But for most of those affected, coronavirus creates only mild or moderate symptoms, such as fever and cough, with the vast majority recovering from the virus.

According to the World Health Organization, people with mild illness recover in about two weeks, while those with more severe ailments may take three to six weeks to rebound. In mainland China, where the virus first exploded, more than 80,000 people have been diagnosed, but more than 58,000 already have recovered.

And remember that an unknown, but likely large, number of people have, or have had, Coronovirus and were never tested for it. Death rates are driven by the denominator and we don’t know what that is. All we can definitively say is that the denominator is much higher than we have actually counted.


0956, 12 March 2020


  1. jonnyv

    Owen is 100% right here. The death rate is probably lower than we believe and the infection rate higher.

    Clearly that doesn’t mean we don’t take precautions. After being woefully behind the rest of the world, the president is finally starting to take this more seriously. Even if he can’t get his messaging straight on national TV.

    This is most dangerous for our most vulnerable people. Elderly and already sick. We really just need to make sure that this is a slow burn and not a spike, so that we don’t run into the same problems that someplace like Italy is having with beds running out all at once.

    Just be smart.

  2. jjf

    What’ll make the death-rate in the US different from the situation in China or Italy?

  3. Mar

    If you take away the deaths in the nursing home in Seattle, more people are murdered in Chicago in a month than killed by this virus.
    Vasy more people died from the Swine Flu when Obama was president and there was much less panic.
    Gee, I wonder why?

  4. jjf

    So far, Mar.  So far.

    Tell me all about the swine flu.

  5. Mar

    Ok, jjf, what’s your point?

  6. jjf

    Obama did something, Trump said he didn’t.

    But hey, all those open-carry guns in AZ will protect you from the virus, right?

    Comparing the death rates from other causes does what?  Tells you this pandemic won’t matter?  So foolish.  Other people are concerned about murders in Chicago and “regular” influenza.  Some even do something about it.

    What’s your point?  That a new virus that’s swept other countries and killed at unusual rates will somehow avoid yours?

  7. Jason

    Whats wrong jff?  You don’t like someone coming into a discussion with a bunch of non-related whataboutism’s and random questions?  Who does that on a regular basis, I wonder?



  8. jjf

    Jason, you do love to pile on.  You don’t generally add any salient facts or even random speculations.  You’re the guy who says “Yah!” after the other guy tries to make a point.  I can see why you like Trump.  He’s a tribe-builder.  You’re a follower.

  9. Kevin Scheunemann

    There it is, libs attacking Trump with latest doomsday cult BS.

    Awful. Just awful.

  10. jjf

    Doomsday cult?  You slay me.

    To reword @lucasbane28 from the Twitters, “Dudes with 30 guns and 30,000 rounds in their basement “just in case” are suddenly like “I think everybody needs to calm down.” “

  11. dad29

    you like Trump.  He’s a tribe-builder.  You’re a follower.

    Written by someone who ought to know about “following,” not “building.”

  12. jjf

    Go on, Dad29.  Tell us how Trump is a builder.  Tell us how his press conference is a fine example of New Testament expression of how to care for the sick.

  13. Jason

    >You don’t generally add any salient facts or even random speculations.

    My cocker spaniel posts more salient facts than you, dummy.


  14. Mar

    Gee, jjf, what does the New Testament say about how to care for the sick?

  15. MjM

    Jiffy warbles: “a fine example of New Testament expression of how to care for the sick.”

    Today, Bumblin’ Joe Biden, speaking in Wilmington, Delaware, trashed Prez Trump’s handling of viral outbreak, claiming, “This virus laid bare the severe shortcomings of the current administration.”. He then went on to explain what he would be doing.

    Biden said it was imperative to get university and private labs into CHINESE virus testing.

    OOPS! Two weeks ago Prez Trump ordered the FDA to allow hundreds of such labs to start testing.

    Biden said small bizzes are going to need help economically.

    OOPS! Yesterday, Prez Trump called for $50 billion in liquidity for small bizzes and wants congress critters to authorize more.

    Biden called for insurance companies to wave co-pays for virus testing.

    OOPS! Trump announced that two days ago, along with insurers agreeing to add the CHINESE virus to coverage.

    Biden then demanded accelerating the development of a vaccine for the novel CHINESE virus.

    OOPS! Prez Trump ordered fast tracking vaccine development back in January.

    Bumblin’ Joe Biden; a day, two days, two weeks, a month-and-a-half late, WAY more than a few dollars short, and still plagiarizing after 54 years.

  16. Kevin Scheunemann

    Libs don’t let facts get in way of their feelings.

    Trump has been leading, but disgusting liberal media keep lynching him on their latest hysteria.

  17. MjM

    Meanwhile, House Majority Drunk Nancy Pelosi, after intentionally delaying the CHINESE virus economic stimulus bill so democrats could run commercials slamming Prez Trump before SuperTuesday, was caught trying to slip federal funding for abortion clinics into the bill.

  18. jjf

    MjM, where’d you copy-and-paste that from?

  19. dad29

    Looks like original work to me, Jiffy.\

    Facts are such a bitch, ain’a?  The Talking Kohlrabi–when he knows where he is and who he is–just can’t keep up with Trump.

  20. Kevin Scheunemann

    Liberals and their communism are immorally disgusting. Crisis exposes the awful immorality.

  21. Le Roi du Nord

    And again the highly educated mar, possessing multiple medical degrees, confuses single payer with an overwhelming patient load. Bravo!!

  22. Mar

    So, Pathological Liar Le Roi, how many medical degrees do you have?
    I spent about 30 years in the medical field working at one job or another. So, I have some experience working with infectious diseases. And you?
    Perhaps Italy would not be so overwhelmed if their medical system was better and the UK is facing the same problem. Their medical systems are underfunded and so they let old people die.
    Too bad, Le Roi, you have no empathy for those victims.

  23. dad29

    Italy has problems due to these underlying conditions:

    1)  the Italian population is skewing old.  Very old.  Vast majority of the deaths so far have been people >80 y.o., not unlike Kirkland situation.

    2)  Many Northern Italian leather-goods industries now owned by Chinese.  Lotsa flights back and forth from Wuhan, lots of Chinese “guest” workers from same area.

    And yes, the hospitals are a problem.

  24. Le Roi du Nord

    That isn’t my point. The point is the article you attached isn’t about single payer, it is about how an overwhelmed system makes choices as to who gets treated. Triage is always part of an emergency situation. As a “medical professional “ you should know that.

  25. Kevin Scheunemann


    But in case of Italy, if triage hurts or kills you, you, or your family have no legal recourse.

    That happens in U.S., you have recourse!

    That is why U.S. will rarely get to this situation,because there is incentive to do a great job!

    This is where communist immorality comes into play heavily.


  26. Mark Hoefert

    This is where communist immorality comes into play heavily.

    Speaking of immorality, 5 cases in Dane County.  3 of them traced to a Lutheran Church in Sun Prairie.

    Thursday there were 7 confirmed cases in WI – on Friday 19.  Following same trajectory as everywhere else – count may double every day. 36 today, 72 tomorrow, 144 on Monday, etc.

    As of yesterday, most of the cases (63%) are in counties adjacent to Washington County.  6 in Fond du Lac, 3 in Sheboygan, 2 in Milwaukee, 1 in Waukesha. My neighbor has a friend in Fond du Lac who works in an office where one of the Fond du Lac victims worked – the office has been closed and people expected to do what they can from home. She has a friend that is a nurse at a hospital that is treating a different victim.



  27. Le Roi du Nord


    Explain how triage will hurt you. For a change, use some facts.

    Mark: Thanks for the update. We need to be vigilant around those WOW county Lutheran communists.

  28. Mark Hoefert

    I may be wrong on the rate of trajectory – some sources are saying it doubles every 7 days.

  29. Kevin Scheunemann



    In a national health care system, you rarely have incentive to maximize your patient load, you have no urgency.   In fact, you have incentive to minimize your patient load.

    In U.S. you have incentive to get through the triage and see as many as you can.

    You are really playing dumb for someone that claims to be smart.


  30. MjM

    Mark sez: “I may be wrong on the rate of trajectory “

    … or your initial one day doubling may be low, but not necessarily because of ‘new’ cases.

    First, testing for this specific bug has just begun in earnest. This means previous tests marked as ‘unknown’ may turn out to be the new Chinese bug (2018-2019 WI flu season had more than 18,000 combined IA and IB unknowns).

    Second, given the national freakout everyone with a slight stomach rumble is gonna run to the doctor. Hypochondriacs aside, even those who would not normally seek medical attention for low-ball symptoms probably will, and some of those will most certainly test out as the Chinese bug.

    Which is, in a way, actually a good thing. As the number of confirmed cases – and survivals- grows the death rate will plummet (again) counteracting all this silly hysteria over just another flu bug.

  31. Le Roi du Nord


    And what is your experience with national health care system? What factual data did you use to come to your conclusion? Or is this just yet another example of your making all sorts of false claims to make you feel important?

    FYI: Italy was ranked by WHO (2019) as 2nd best healthcare in the world. US was 37th, 2 spots above Cuba.

  32. dad29

    WHO or not, friends of mine who’ve been in Italy are NOT fans of the hospitals over there; they prefer the Americans.  (As to dental, you’re better off in any 3rd-world dental chair than in Italy.)

  33. Jason

    >And what is your experience with national health care system? What factual data did you use to come to your conclusion? 

    Hey Leroy, tell us what experience the WHO “ranking scientists” have with it.  If you have any common sense at all, you’ll pass.

  34. Kevin Scheunemann

    Oh Nord,

    You are so clueless. Italy just decided to stop treating elderly infected with virus.

    Your ignorance is stunning.

  35. Le Roi du Nord

    WHO put out all sorts of data in their report. You folks can look it up as easily as I did if you were actually interested.

    Clueless, no. I just gave some and I have more

  36. Kevin Scheunemann


    Socialized health care Italy has stopped treating elderly!

    What is tgeir recourse in a government run system?

    Will you not denounce this socialism decision as being against human rights?

    Oh I forgot, you take no stands against evil when it is socialist evil.

  37. Mar

    So, Le Roi, if you get the Corona virus now, where would you rather be treated? In the US or Italy?

  38. jjf

    Kevin, what’s your recourse in your system?  What’s your Dilly Bar making employee’s recourse?

  39. Kevin Scheunemann


    In U.S., immediate solution, you can go to another health care provider.   It’s called “choice”.  Long term recourse is civil, suing for malpractice, wrongful death, etc.

    You can’t sue government provided health care for wrongful death,etc.

    Why are you communist libs so purposely thick?


  40. Le Roi du Nord


    Since I live in northern WI, and since Italy isn’t on my bucket list for travel, it really isn’t a relevant question.   I live here and will be treated here if the need arises.

  41. Le Roi du Nord


    “Socialized health care Italy has stopped treating elderly!”

    Is this another one of your imaginary claims?  Or do you have proof?

  42. jjf

    Go on, Kevin, tell us more…  tell us how American exceptionalism will protect us from the spread of the virus, and even if it looks like we’re on the same curve as Italy, your health insurers won’t make decisions like that about your life.

    Because, after all, if you can’t get a ventilator with your insurer, you can just blink twice and the nurse will know that you want to switch plans pronto!

    What kind of insurance does your lowest Dilly Bar maker get from you?

  43. Mar

    Thanks for dodging the question, Le Roi, unless you never heard of hypothetical questions.

  44. Le Roi du Nord


    I deal in reality, you can go hypothetical all you want.  I have no desire to go to Italy, never had, never will, so I gave you an honest answer.  Try it sometime.

  45. Le Roi du Nord


    And once again you send a link that won’t open.  Bravo.   But by reading the link I came across the word “suggest”, which does not imply that they stopped treating the elderly.  One article that I did find on-line used the word “urge”, but didn’t mention any action to stop treating anyone.

  46. jjf

    Le Roi, it’s like he didn’t even search for examples of denied coverage or services in the US private insurance system.  Death panels, I tell ya!

  47. Kevin Scheunemann

    Liberals…ignoring basic human rights for over 100 years.

    Awful. Just awful.

  48. jjf

    Come on, Kevin, tell us about the insurance you offer the Dilly Bar maker.

    Imagine if small businesses didn’t need to do that.

  49. Le Roi du Nord


    Since he doesn’t want to be bothered by reality he makes stuff up, trying to make himself more important in the eyes of a few followers.

  50. jjf

    BuT wE DoN’T kNoW tHe denoMinaTor!

    And Illinois just closed all the bars and restaurants.


    It’s not like Kevin’s going to catch anything from the Dilly Bar maker, so why should he worry about their health care options?  They damn well better be at work at 10 a.m. tomorrow morning.  He pays their wages, you know.

  51. Kevin Scheunemann

    My “Dilly Bar maker” is 73 and is mandated to be in Medicare. She works because she enjoys interacting and getting out of the house. Stop makung it sound like something nefarious in you disgusting, putrid, comments

    You liberals are awful. Truly awful.

    Instead of focusing on human right problems with your grossly evil ideology you tear good, sweet, wonderful people down.

    Despicable. Reprehensible.

  52. Jason

    >Since he doesn’t want to be bothered by reality he makes stuff up, trying to make himself more important in the eyes of a few followers.

    That makes me think of the time you claimed to be an employer because you cliamed that you supervised a couple state workers. You probably still dont realize how stupid you sounded back then. Lol

  53. Mark Hoefert

    Kevin:  You can’t sue government provided health care for wrongful death,etc.

    In England you can.

    The government needs to take a stronger and more integrated approach if it is to rein in the increasing cost of clinical negligence claims across the health and justice systems, according to the National Audit Office.
    Over the last ten years, spending on the Clinical Negligence Scheme for Trusts has quadrupled from £0.4 billion in 2006-07 to £1.6 billion in 2016-17, while the number of successful clinical negligence claims where damages were awarded has more than doubled, from 2,800 to 7,300. The cost of clinical negligence claims is rising at a faster rate year-on-year, than NHS funding, adding to the financial pressures already faced by many trusts, which can have an impact on patients’ access to services and quality of care. In addition, trusts spending a higher proportion of their income on clinical negligence are significantly more likely to be in deficit. In 2015-16, for example, all 14 trusts which spent 4% or more of their income on clinical negligence were in deficit.



  54. jjf

    Kevin, you love the drama.  We don’t know your Dilly Bar maker.  Nothing personal.  But you don’t offer health care to your employees?

  55. Kevin Scheunemann


    Uk is a limited exception…but as,you can see, they acknowledge huge problem with negkigance and they allocate nominal amounts toward it. Trials are probably difficult to win…and there is always temptation to drain this to funnel toward doctor raises, who work below market rates and patient shortages in care.

    It is nothing like civil recourse available in U.S.

  56. Kevin Scheunemann


    You just keep on coming back for more without doing any soul searching, whatsoever, on your damaging ideology? Interesting.

  57. Kevin Scheunemann


    That is personal doctor cap. There is also recourse against underlying company or other entities.

  58. Le Roi du Nord


    No, that wasn’t what I said.  But believe what you want.

  59. Jason

    >No, that wasn’t what I said. But believe what you want.

    And that reminds me of the time you were called out on being an “employer” and you tried to back peddle. Do you find yourself yelling “Hey you guys!” a lot?

  60. Le Roi du Nord


  61. Jason



  62. Mark Hoefert

    That is personal doctor cap. There is also recourse against underlying company or other entities.

    I don’t have a clue what the hell you are talking about. I get the impression you are trying to correlate the corona virus situation to socialized medicine, communists, and liberals.

    “Recourse” can cost a lot of money – many people can not upfront the legal expenses to seek recourse.

    By the way, this morning I dropped my daughter off at work – West Bend traffic was very sparse. Washington Street West at 18th lights are usually stacked with traffic heading towards the Highway 45 onramp – a total of 4 west bound cars at the light when it changed green.  Around the corner at the McDonalds entrance there are sometimes cars in a que on 18th waiting to get into the drive-through lanes – no line at all today – you could pull right up to the order kiosks – both of them.

  63. Kevin Scheunemann


    This article makes it more clear. The non-economic cap is $750k. (I don’t agree with the rule, BTW). Economic damages are still unlimited.

    This is for doctor. The underlying health care/hospital company doctor works for can also be held to damages as well.

    My point was: in socialized medicine countries you do not have anywhere close to this kind of civil recourse. You are a slave to the rules set up to protect the socialized system.

  64. Le Roi du Nord


    In a few keystrokes I found numerous articles describing medical malpractice suits in Italy.  How many, how much, who is liable, etc.  There was even several law firms advertising their services.  In a nutshell, there is civil recourse in Italy, and it is fairly robust.

Pin It on Pinterest