This is not accidental or caused by Covid. This is the result of our governor intentionally shutting down our economy.
“If projections suggested in the national financial press are that 29 percent of privately held establishments will be shut down, and we assume shutdowns are proportionately distributed across firm employment size, then 48,619 Wisconsin business establishments would be closed,” Tichenor said in an email.
Those closings would affect 724,362 employees, he said.
That figure, combined with a February statewide workforce number of 3,109,100, results in an unemployment rate of 23.3 percent.
Then, if the 108,900 Wisconsin residents already unemployed in February are added, the unemployment rate would increase to approximately 26.8 percent, Tichenor said.
Owen, your saying that you think Evers should NOT have shut down the state of WI. He should have left if open and been one of the few outliers in the WORLD? He should have gone against all scientific information out there.
We should have risked 10%, 100%, 500% increase in the number of cases that WI currently has?
Should he have left it up to the counties? Should he have left it up to the businesses?
Should he have just limited the number of people in an establishment?
Keep the economy going. A couple lives lost because of it shouldn’t be a deterrent to benefiting anyone’s economic well being. It’s for the greater good. Heck, people die from falling off their roofs and we don’t outlaw going up on roofs.
JonnyV, Owen just wants to make Evers look bad. He’s not proposing any solution.
Oppressive liberalism is a virus and can be just as deadly.
Hey, jjf, let’s go back to horse and buggy. There would be very few deaths on the highway and roads.
Are you secretly Amish?
I don’t think needs to make Evers look bad. Evers is doing a really good of looking bad by himself.
Mar, tell me your plan, show me some experts who agree with it. Let me guess: we shouldn’t have shut down, no lockdown, the infection rate goes crazy, more people die than are dying now because hospitals are overflowing, but hey, some of them were old and were going to die anyways. Did I get it right?
Or we could have fun trying to imagine what a Republican governor would’ve done. If they’d shut down, Owen would still be cheerleading in his usual way, saying we need to support our governor, vaguely hedging here and there (“I might not support all of these policies”) but he’d still be a loyal AFP / WisGOP follower.
Our leaders had 4 months to develop safe procedures to operate during this crisis. Dems danced and played the racist card when Trump started closing travel down. Now Dems are locking things down even tighter as Trump says we have to restart the economy. Meanwhile private enterprise and have been moving forward developing and testing improvised masks. (2 layers of blue shop towels seem to make a good mask.)
It’s time for government to stop telling us what we can’t do, and start telling us how to do things safely. It’s time for government to stop telling business they are unessential, realize all businesses are essential as they provide jobs and careers that allow people to live. Government has to start telling business how they can safely operate. It’s time for government to start working for the people, not against us.
Or the WisGOP can sit and brainstorm about their next power grab instead of dealing with the effects of the virus.
“Mar, tell me your plan, show me some experts who agree with it. Let me guess: we shouldn’t have shut down, no lockdown, the infection rate goes crazy, more people die than are dying now because hospitals are overflowing, but hey, some of them were old and were going to die anyways. Did I get it right?”
First, jjf, what you said is unknowable.
We are also not building up immunity to the virus, which means the virus will come back and do more devastation later.
Yes, some places should have shut down. NYC, some other metro areas etc, while other places had 0 illnesses and they were shut down earlier. What do you say to those people?
I have a Republican governor and I think he is an idiot for shutting down the entire state where there they have a few cases in the Phoenix area and there are other areas that no cases and he shut down those areas. I hope he gets primaried.
And jjf, your reaction has been despicable. You are cheering for more deaths and a wrecked economy just because of your hatred of President Trump. You want higher numbers and you want chaos. You have been proven wrong at every turn. You wanted death panels, there have been none. You wanted hospitals to be overrun and you were wrong. You wanted wanted medical supplies, especially ventilators to run out and you were wrong. You want President Trump to fail and are wrong again.
But I don’t totally blame as you are not able to think independently. You get your talking points from the media and then you just repeat what they said. You just are just a liberal bot,incapable of independent thought.
At no point have I cheered for more deaths. There is no one out there promoting suppression who is cheering for more deaths. They want fewer deaths.
There are people out there who are advocating for less stringent or even no suppressive restrictions, and indeed, they are saying it’s better to have more deaths than to hurt the economy.
If hospitals aren’t overflowing, if we have enough ventilators, then the suppression has succeeded.
“If hospitals aren’t overflowing, if we have enough ventilators, then the suppression has succeeded.”
So, you got the liberal talking points? Good for you for parroting them.
And it is not known if the suppression is the reason why the the deaths are way down from the predictions early on. It could be the sky is falling crowd got their numbers wrong to begin with…like they usually are…wrong.
But let’s say, the suppression is the reason for the lower number of deaths predicted.
Then you will have to give President Trump credit, won’t you.
Don’t like the cause and effect here? Then tell me what would’ve happened with hospitals and ventilators under your preferred plan.
Trump can’t keep his own story straight minute-to-minute even within the same press conference. Which version of his story do you want to give him credit for?
Waves of suppression is the best approach. It’s what the epidemiologists recommended from the start. And yes, Trump’s own plan is that, too. He’s botched many aspects of it, but suppression is still the core of it.
Mar. No. Trump deserves almost NO credit here. This is the governors who get all the credit and blame. Had Trump been prepared and had more ventilators ready, had he taken this seriously at ALL before early March we could be having a different conversation.
Trump was actually a hindrance in almost all public aspects until early March by being dismissive. The federal gov’t should have been ready to support the governors and they were not. Instead Trump has used every opportunity to either push unconfirmed vaccines, flood Florida with equipment other places need more, or use the podium as a Trump rally almost daily.
The graphs and models may have been on the high side, or worst case scenarios, but I personally would rather be on the safe side than underestimate something that could be catastrophic.
The hospitals would have been fine. Chaotic at times but fine. They train for this constantly.
When Las Vegas had the mass shooting a couple of years ago, they treated hundreds of victims overnight, including the critically injured. They also had to treat all the other sick and injured that usually comes to the hospital at night. They didn’t panic, they did what were trained to do.
It’s to bad you have such little faith in the front line medical professionals but then, your liberal minders haven’t told you what to say about them and their training.
Yes, they train for all sorts of scenarios. The problem that was people would be looking at extended stays. Taking up beds for days or a week at a time. I live 2 blocks from St. Lukes Hospital in Milwaukee. They were preparing for what appeared to be a war zone just 2 weeks ago.
One of my best friends works at St. Lukes as well. They were told they shouldn’t be wearing homemade masks even though they were not allowed to get masks due to the shortages.
I have all the faith in the world in the people who work there. But there is only so much you can do when an extended tidal wave hits if you don’t have the resources.
Yes, and some even longer. Mar, did you read the stories about medical professionals in NYC? Are they having a good time? Do they feel like they have enough?
Not true. They want LATER deaths.
We’re now well-enough informed on “projections” to understand that they are by-and-large, SWAGs. This thing will kill at the rate the flu does. So get a vaccine next year. Meantime, 25% of Wisconsin’s workers are going to starve in about 6 weeks—and unemployment is like cancer: it spreads if not stomped on.
Are you fool enough to think that no one else will be affected? Rent unpaid, cars un-bought, ……..well, given your insistence that NO DEATHS ARE ACCEPTABLE, brainless as it is, I guess you are fool enough.
Suppression isn’t about “no deaths,” but you know that, right Dad29? It’s about avoiding the extra deaths when the hospitals overflow.
But you’ve got plenty of ammo, so you’ll be safe, right?
DMOTP Jiffy divines: “…avoiding the extra deaths when the hospitals overflow.”
Where are all these over-stuffed hospitals you are continually are harping about?
Are you saying some deaths are acceptable in order to maintain economic stability?
I worded my question incorrect. I should have said, are some deaths acceptable in order to maintain economic stability?
“I worded my question incorrect. I should have said, are some deaths acceptable in order to maintain economic stability?”
We do it all the time Pat. I already told dumbass 1 & 2, jjf and Le Roi, that it happens constantly. From the food we eat, to the pesticides that put on the crops, to driving on the roads, to the military, to the medications we talk, to the governments that have an inner city in their jurisdiction and the number of murders in their city.
I sincerely hope you get it, as the other 2 sure don’t.
“It’s about avoiding the extra deaths when the hospitals overflow.”
Sorry, jjf, you mean your liberal overlords didn’t tell you that in Washington state that they are sending back ventilators and closed down a field hospital, that in NYC, the medical ship has very few patients and most other areas are dealing the patients they have do not need extra help.
I sure hope that your liberal overlords update tell you something so you won’t sound like such an ignorant fool.
I do realize you also begging for more deaths so President Trump looks bad. And you are not alone in that feeling, so don’t feel so bad, you have plenty of company in your hate.
“ I sincerely hope you get it, as the other 2 sure don’t.”
In other words, tough decisions need to be made at times in order to protect our economic freedoms. And, death is an acceptable decision in order to protect those freedoms.
>death is an acceptable decision in order to protect those freedoms.
It appears that death is acceptable to many Last year influenza related deaths in the US in 2019 were approximately equal to the current count of deaths from covid-19 Globally.
Ok, Pat, I guess you are part of the 3 Stooges. Therefore, park your car, eat baby food, don’t ever take a shower again, don’t leave your house ever again, kick everybody out of your house, turn off the electricity but don’t light a candle and never take any medicine. Any of those items can get you killed. And if you are a victim of a crime or get sick or start a fire because then you are putting the first responders at risk. Don’t order delivery food either or get any mail because you are putting the delivery driver and post office employee at risk.
And if somehow, in the world of the 3 Stooges, if Cuba decides to invade us, just let them because God forbid, you are putting our military at risk of possible death.
And further, there has been an increase of domestic violence calls. I guess the victims just need to suck it up.
And those who have committed suicide from being isolated, who really cares about them, right?
I wasn’t arguing against your point. I agree that there are unintended consequences to everyday activities which may, or may not result in death. I was attempting to glean from you clarification on your stance. You haven’t answered my question in regards to the acceptance of death as a conscience decision for individual economic freedom.
You’ve pissed and moaned about the inability for some to hold a civil conversation and yet, here you are doing the exact thing you bemoan others of doing.
And Patsy……get out from under your bed and answer me this: are you saying that economic collapse is the right solution to suppressing Flu-A (swine flu)?
Ok, I misunderstood your response, and I apologize.
Yes, there are acceptable risks in life regarding death and economics and it is not just the economy that is affected. What about the social costs like the increase in domestic violence calls? What about lack of exercise? What about the increase in stress? What about the dependence on the computer and TV for many people?
It just not dollars and cents.
Is Coronavirus the same as “the flu”?
Again, I see your point. Dud says that death is an acceptable decision for personal economic freedom. It sounds like that is your position also. Please correct me if I’m wrong in that assumption.
In 2017, on average, 7700 people died in the US each day.
Yesterday, 2000 people died directly or indirectly from the Corona Virus.
The way the media talks and writes about the Virus, you would think that no other people are dying.
Just something to ponder while you are sitting in isolation.
If the only reason to open the lockdowns is solely economic and nothing else, then that would be wrong.
But just about everything is intertwined with other things in the universe, so, it is just economic.
And you you know this has to suck for kids. Not going outside, not going to school, not being with friends, no participation in athletic games, no dating.
This might be good for the very nerdist but not for most kids.
Is the personal decision to have an abortion, based on a persons economic freedom, acceptable?
Patsy seems shocked: “And, death is an acceptable decision in order to protect those freedoms.”
Look in the mirror, sistah, because you’ve supported that to the tune of some 900,000 deaths every year for decades.
Pat, they could put the baby up for adoption. If they need help while pregnant, I am sure it is out there.
But, the question still remains, is the personal decision to have an abortion, based on a persons economic freedom, acceptable?
If you want my personal opinion, no. My view is abortion should only occur if the mothers life is in danger or rape.
But that’s just my personal opinion.
Not sure how this relates to the subject though.
It relates to deaths being acceptable based on economic freedom.
Right, Mar, everyone is saying there are no other deaths other than COVID.
Really, jjf, where are they saying it? Other than murders and car crashes.
Patsy, shivering under his bed, does not understand the difference between a deliberate taking of innocent life and an incidental ‘passing on’ of Flu-A, Flu-B, or Chinese Lung-Rot–which is not deliberate, nor a ‘taking of life.
Mar, in that case you are killing the innocent child of a criminal. Following your logic there would leave a lot of dead kids in certain areas of–say–Chicago.
Patsy-Orie-Orie-Aaaaaayyyy….keep up with the news. Chinese Lung-AIDS has about the same mortality rate as that of Flu-B: 0.3%. But it doesn’t cause pneumonia; it’s direct rather than indirect.
See, a far more accurate denominator is available in California, and by the way, out there herd immunity is doing an excellent job of flattening the curve. NOT “hide under your bed”–herd immunity.
Trust me, I’m not hiding under my bed over this. I also am not moved by tin-foil hat conspiracies that are promoted by alt right numb skulls such as yourself.
Point to the ‘conspiracy theory,’ Patsy.
Well, Dad29, you said the Chinese created it because they want to take over the world.
Or to put it another way re: abortion, Dad29, you’re forcing the victim of a crime to endure a pregnancy and have a child of their rapist!
But Heaven knows you’re always thinking of the women.
That’s not a “conspiracy.” Conspiracies–by definition–require more than one actor.
In any case, the Chinese Communists have openly stated that they wish to dominate the entire world, including the USA. Sending a nice little germ over here which has the effect of setting the USA back financially is a good way to–at minimum–send a message.
Prove me wrong.
Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding
Dictionary says: “a belief that some covert but influential organization is responsible for a circumstance or event.”
Patsy remains blind: “the question still remains, is the personal decision to have an abortion, based on a persons economic freedom, acceptable?”
The answer is, of course, HELL NO. Aside from that being obvious, that you are even weighing the two situations as similar is beyond illogical.
Thank you for your opinion.
Hey, ding-a-ling……I’m waiting for an intelligent response.
The definition(s) of “CONSPIRACY” are:
As I said, “Conspiracies require more than one actor.”
Conspiracy theories as you define them are clearly mis-named.
Produce your source and facts to prove your correct.
Oh no, Dad29 stands athwart language, yelling “stop!”
Nope, Patsy. Time for you to do some actual research instead of making assertions without evidence.
Yah! Typical alt right nut job. Can’t back up their conspiracies with substantiated facts. Enough said.
Oh, and don’t quote Daily Mail. They are noted as unreliable containing “Right, Propaganda, Conspiracy, Some Fake News”.
Now, then, Patsy…….the essay is mid-length and contains words with more than 2 syllables, so I know it may be a tough slog for you.
But start here: https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/04/communist_chinas_war_for_global_dominance_and_the_wuhanvirus_pandemic_.html
I already gave you the key graf, but there’s plenty for you to learn in there.
Prove me wrong, numbnutz.
MAr, why can’t we have nice, civilized rational conversation without name-calling here? It’s just a Mystery.
Sorry Dud, but The American Thinker is another tin foil hat alt right biased site noted to be, “ Extreme Right, Conspiracy, Propaganda, Lack of Ownership Transparency”.
You’ll have to provide information from an actual credible fact based source if you want to be taken seriously.
No, I don’t “have to” do crap for you, Patsy.
Prove me wrong, Patsy.
Okay, Dud. You don’t have to do anything. Should be easy, that’s what your best at.
Patsy cannot come up with facts; they are hard to find while hiding under the bed in Mom’s basement, eh?
I’m still waiting for something from an actual credible fact based source. So far you have nothing.
Come now, Pat. I’m sure Dad29 has a deep knowledge of the ways that the USA has spread itself around the globe, striving for dominance.
While you’re at it jjf, when are you going to admit President Trump has done a good job dealing with the virus admit you were wrong about the numbers of victims and deaths, the death panels, the hospitals would be overwhelmed, not enough ventilators etc?
You and Le Roi have been wrong every step of the way.
Ain’t over ’til it’s over, Mar.
Does your bubble of media tell you about the way the Feds are out-bidding the governors on PPE? Nice, huh? Helpful!
Good job, the best job! Everyone’s saying it’s perfect, like the perfect phone call. And have you seen his Facebook ratings lately?
Wow, jjf, using a Facebook poll as evidence. And here I was hoping there would some intelligence in your cranium. I guess I was wrong.
And you continue to hope there are more deaths. You must get on your knees each night praying for more deaths to make Peesident Trump look bad. That is very Grim Reaper of you.
Finally, if the states and hospitals had been more prepared properly, they would not have been in short supply. But since they are, and you forgot to mention that states are also outbidding other states, including California, they are turning to the Feds for the equipment.
But I will give you credit. You take the talking points your liberal overlords give you and you try valiantly to spin your side of story but no matter how you try, you and your ilk are just plain wrong.
Just like climate change.
Facebook poll? What are you talking about?
It’s not like more and more people are supporting Trump, right? He’s failing on his own. I don’t think prayer would make a difference.
“Facebook poll? What are you talking about?”
“And have you seen his Facebook ratings lately?”
I guess it is a little early in the morning for you, jjf. Them neurons of yours just are not clicking yet.
But I guess when you have been proven wrong so many times, I guess you have to take a hail Mary and refer to a Facebook rating.
Oh, that? Hey, I’m just quoting what the President said about himself during a recent virus update, because you know, that’s important. But that’s so twelve days ago! Did you know he’s number one on Facebook?
Sorry mar, but it is you and your lying buddy trump that have been wrong at every turn. Your game changing knockout drug still isn’t approved, folks are still getting sick and passing away, and Keith Hernandez still isn’t a murderer.
The Uneducated Duo Fools strike again.
No drug has been approved for the virus. You’re just mad that your supply of the drug is going to up in price. And the FDA did approve it.
Say what you will about Trump, but he is organizing the best way he can but he does not call the shots for the states.
But I will give you 1 small thing. I don’t like people boasting about themselves.
Pretty much everyone accepts that quantities of deaths are an acceptable measure in economics. Aside from war (pretty much all fought for economics) the most dramatic decision, there is an entire gamut of Government determined deaths based on economics. From anyone who invents and/or takes any modern medicine to accepting that any significant technological advance can wipe out multiple categories of jobs/careers/lifestyles for the outdated tech(s). How many new drugs don’t have side effects that ‘lead to death’? All FDA approved, of course. We are all complicit too whether we agree with one, but deny another specific example or two is immaterial. You accept the death of the people who went into developing any drug, hormone or pesticide every time you buy it.
And the greatest rallying cry for accepting this grisly sounding circumstance is often “Think how many we will save!” which is most often unknowable even as an estimate. How many won’t die from CV19 because we shut down much of the economy? How many will die as an indirect result of shutting down much of the economy? I think both sides have pretty good arguments, at least regionally.
Covid19 is just another example of constant decisions from our Government that lead to the death of its citizens. The main difference is the level of media coverage (The last time I remember this much media concentration on a death count was George W’s war in Iraq.). We could have listened to Dr. Fauci the moment he spoke up and some of the people would have still died. We may well have had a significant uptick in starvation and crime related deaths at this point too, so it is always a weighing of variables. Dr Fauci is one and only one variable in the Covid19 epidemic and I would condemn any politician that looked at only one angle for every political conundrum.
There, no name calling…