NewsBusters caught this statement from Wisconsin’s senator.
“Certainly the first amendment says that in institutions of faith that there is absolute power to, you know, to observe deeply held religious beliefs. But I don’t think it extends far beyond that.”
Notice that she extends the right to exercise religion to religious institutions and not to individuals. The last time I checked, the Bill of Rights enumerates and protects individual rights – not institutional rights.
Does this mean she is going after Muslims on this?
…or just Christians?
Free exercise of religion is under attack and the liberals, like Baldwin, are making sure we only read from her bible.
The liberal religion is the only religion we will be allowed to have…embrace and rationalize everything evil…from soft on crime policies, to murder by abortion, to marriage other than God’s design of one man, one woman.
Separation of church and state will shockingly have the state in churches at the pulpit.
Liberalism is about to get even more disgusting of free speech and free exercise of religion, if that is even possible.
The attacks are underway. The Milwaukee Art Museum The museum received the work called “Eggs Benedict” piece from homo-sexual rights activist Joseph Pabst who paid Niki Johnson $25,000 for it. It will display the portrait this fall.This has nothing to do with starting a discussion about aids. It is an all-out assault by left wing homo-sexuals on the Catholic church because of its stance on homo-sexualality. And there will be no pushback by the remaining leftists because of the Catholic Churches stance on abortion. The two will work hand in glove to destroy any institution that tries to deny or obstruct their chosen lifestyle and beliefs.
You can exercise your religion beliefs right up to where my consttutuonal rights are compromised by your deeply held belief in magic
Mark,
My rights are constantly compromised by the exercise of your goofy religions, evolution and the warming cult.
Kev,
My goofy religion ( science ) changes with new data . ( like how old the planet is)
Your religion is based upon a book written by many with thousands of transcriptions and Some serious rewrites to make the Old Testament and New Testament match up
( note that I don’t refer to it as goofy , just magical )
Thank God for those Irish Monks :)
I have no problem with what you believe .
If you must , call my “religions ” fact based goofiness and yours :
“Good and bad actions of folks long ago but eons after the world was created that may or may not have happened but has no scientific fact , just earnest belief ” goofiness
I am good with that
M
The only reason my calling your passions a religion gets you in a twist is because you know that means they are subject to hostility and censorship because of what liberals have done to 1st Amendment.
If not, why would you care if I slap religion label on anything?
You should be flattered I recognize the excitement of what you believe in.
“The only reason my calling your passions a religion gets you in a twist is because you know that means they are subject to hostility and censorship because of what liberals have done to 1st Amendment.”
Kevin, you’ve been peddling this line of horse hockey for over three years now, and you’re as wrong today as you were then. People patiently explain their beliefs and motivations to you, and, being pathologically incapable of understanding, much less acknowledging, any point of view but your own, you proceed to tell them what they REALLY think. I know autistic children with more empathy and mental flexibility than you.
Major,
You demonstrate my point. Why would anyone care if I slap the “religion” label on it?
It’s BECAUSE such a label means instant censorship of the subject matter by the left.
Free exercise of religion in full practice under 1st amendment should be a label strived for, not shunned.
We know why that it is. It is the United States of liberal oppression when it comes to religion.
That is why you resist, you don’t want to be treated like the Christians are treated.
Kevin,
How many religions do you belong to?
Pat,
Interesting question. Nearly any conservative speech is subject to the “religion” shut-up label. Nearly every life issue brushed by the book of Probverbs and Psalms is subject to the “shut-up” religious label.
So in answer to your question, I probably belong to a number of religions, determined by liberals, needed, to shut me up.
If speech is going to be treated in this manner, and its difficult to deny seing the responses to me here on this issue, its only “fair” liberal speech and religions suffer…I mean enjoy the same treatment.
The actual answer is, the only “religion” I subscribe to at my core is Christ crucified and risen for redemption of my sins by faith alone. (Which is verboten to speak out loud in many areas of our society)
Kevin,
But don’t you belong to the religion of the Republican Party, the religion of Science Denial, the religion of Anti-Social Freedom, among others.
Don’t you kneel at the feet of, and worship the prophet Walker?
Pat said,
“But don’t you belong to the religion of the Republican Party, the religion of Science Denial, the religion of Anti-Social Freedom, among others.
Don’t you kneel at the feet of, and worship the prophet Walker?”
1.) Religion of Republican party: Answer “No”. So long as we have Robin Vos’s running around it’s really Democrat liberal religion lite worshipping at the alter of road builders.
2.) Religion of Science denial: Answer “No”. I support actual science, not pretend science that that hopes to be proven correct someday, like the warming cult, or evolution cult. So I deny pretend science, not actual science.
3.) Religion of anti-social freedom. Answer “no”. I support 1st amendment, especially the free exercise of religion, not the suppression of speech and free exercise of religion like the left worships.
4.) Do I kneel at feet, and worship Scott walker? Not Lately. His weak leadership on right to Work and Prevailing wage, and support of ethanol subsidy is somewhat irritating. I especially oppose his stance on Bucks arena. Worship? no. Maybe a healthy respect for his past record, maybe.
Kevin,
I should have said you belong to those religions, which you can deny, but you do. You also belong to the religion of self pity, and perpetual victim hood.
Kevin,
Excuse me for cutting into this love fest but I’m truly curious. You stated “I support actual science, not pretend science”. What “actual science” are you referring to. You provide examples of “pretend science”. Can you please provide examples of “actual science”?
Pat,
In other words, I have perfected liberal strategy for non-liberal causes.
Been working on that since college.
Christians ( predominantly white Christians) of one stripe or another have run the show in North America since they landed ,got organized and pushed out the actual residents
That’s why I love the folks who talk about about our Judeo Christian beliefs foundation.
The ones that excluded women from power ,
That allowed for slavery and the desolation
Of the people whose land we coveted .( one of those commandments we weren’t supposed to violate I think)
Then , the ancestors of those illustrious folks talk of our American exceptional ism ”
Christians are still 70% of the country but yearn for the good old days where they called 100% of the shots .
Saying you are discriminated against in any way is preposterous
And some have the balls to play the victim card when the 10 Commandments you cherish and whose ancestors regularly broke or ignored in our expansion are taken out of public places and back into churches where they belong
Christians were born on third base in America and think they hit a triple .
And when the umpire now longer waves them home automatically, they think something has been stolen from them
Tell that story to the american Indians
Mark,
This is the new political reality, thanks to liberalism.
Its all about the better victim card.
I think the “Straight Pride” card is gaining victim status momentum after last week.
May I susggest those who perpetrated heinous acts, and lived contrary to the gospel in mistreatment of others, like slavery, may not have been Christian.
Kevin,
When you complain about what someone else does, and the go and intentionally do the same, makes you a member of of the hypocrite religion. Not a very good example to your children.
Owen:
When will you be changing the name of your blog to “Shit Kevin Scheunemann Says” I can understand your desire to be a mouthpiece for Republicans generally, but for a Kewaskum Village Trustee?
Kevin,
What is “actual science”? One of your repeated themes is about “liberal religion”. Let’s first clear up the definition of religion. According to Webster’s religion is – 1) BELIEF in and worship of God or gods 2) a specific system of BELIEF, WORSHIP, etc., often involving a code of ethics. I capitalized belief and worship because you seem to be under the impression liberals have their own exclusive religion. “Soft on crime policies”, “murder by abortion” and “marriage other than God’s design, of one man, one woman” aren’t beliefs they are policies and laws upheld by The Supreme Court.
I agree with Mark. Historically, Christians have used the bible to excuse atrocities. The Crusades, The Inquisitions, 30 Years’ War, French Wars of Religion, slavery and much more. Today even with the Supreme Court ruling Christians still believe LGBTs don’t deserve the rights afforded to others because of their personal choices. This isn’t based on law it’s based on a belief that lacks ethics. I fail to see the existence of actual religion within the liberal agenda but to be fair and if we follow your standard as well as Webster’s wouldn’t conservatives actually have a religion?… They do have a God they worship and believe in… Ronald Reagan.
Pat said,
“When you complain about what someone else does, and the go and intentionally do the same, makes you a member of of the hypocrite religion. Not a very good example to your children.”
Pat, in this case, it helps shine the light of reality just how dangerous modern day liberalism is to the 1st amendment. Liberals are routing their opponents to shut-up with this complete nuclear war on religion. The only way it is going to get better is to use the same political tactics against the things liberals hold most dear, like evolution and global warming.
Matthew 10:16:
“I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves.”
FF,
Last Post
http://www.bootsandsabers.com/2015/06/15/anne-nicol-gaylor/
Kevin, Did Matthew say that, or did Jesus?
How many religions does the WELS cult allow you to worship?
Kevin,
I reviewed that thread and all of your posts but curiously didn’t see one example of “actual science”. Can you please point out where to find them or give examples? Thanks. I still am unclear, do you think all liberals are non-Christians? Are there no liberals (Democrats) that belong to WELS? I personally know many. I also know many liberals (Democrats) that don’t support abortion. I also know some conservatives (Scott Walker) that allow abortion even though they have the power and support to change it but are unwilling because they are power hungry and fear losing votes. Scott Walker is a coward.
Pat,
Jesus said that.
FF,
Examples of Actual science.
Measure of gravity
Measure of rainfall.
Measure current temperature.
When we start talking about things like future predicted temps or rainfall that is called predicting, some call it fortune telling. In other words its a guess. If your life revolves around the guess of the fortune telling, that’s when it becomes a religion.
That is what is happening with global warming doomsday scenarios, calling for radical action that would destroy economies. Or evolution hoping someday they will find the missing link data to complete the theory. That is pretend science.
Kevin,
How many religions does the WELS cult allow its members to worship?
How do we know that Jesus actually said what Mathew says he said?
Kevin,
Maybe Kewaskum should remove the tornado sirens that warn of predicted tornados. Maybe Japan should get rid of the tsunami warning system or Louisiana could stop predicting hurricanes. These predictions are all based on science. The same science being used to warn of the effects of global warming. Data driven predictions done by educated scientists from many different fields of study are far from predictions. The warning systems in place to protect human life from hurricanes, tornados and tsunamis are all based on similar data. Oh and by the way… gravity hasn’t yet been proven it’s still just a prediction. Physicists are still working out the “actual science” but the prediction that it exists is even believed by you. Ocean levels rising, ice caps melting and measured temperature increases for over a hundred years are the same as an apple falling on your head. Gravity exists as predicted and so does global warming.
Ff,
If gravity has not been proven yet in your book, then the evolution and warming cult must really be out there for you.
Thanks for proving my point .
BTW we do not blow the sirens in Kewaskum until a tornado warning has been issued. That means a tornado has been spotted or radar data says a tornado is forming, it’s data based, not prediction based on faith.
some communities are abandoning their sirens in favor of text messages instead. So you make siren abandonment sound like something nefarious.
Kevin,
Do your research. Really, take a moment to find out what you are talking about. Rainfall and temperature measurements are “actual science” and part of the equation used to determine global warming. Both also play a role in the “radar data” used to predict tornados. The same scientists that developed these “data based” prediction systems are the same scientists warning about the results of global warming. I’m surprised, as a village president I would think you would have a firmer grasp on the science and technology used to predict weather threats. The warning system for tornados is multi-tiered. Blowing the sirens is the last step in the prediction and a sighting is not always required and the radar data is not always conclusive. It is merely a prediction but one we rely on to save lives. If you choose to ignore such science based or “data based” information in the name of profit that’s very irresponsible. Global warming is real and all “data based” research shows humans are a contributing factor. As for gravity… Can you show me the “data based” research that proves it exists? If you can you a Noble Prize is in your future.
FF said,
“Global warming is real and all “data based” research shows humans are a contributing factor. As for gravity… Can you show me the “data based” research that proves it exists? If you can you a Noble Prize is in your future.”
Like weather data, predictions about the future can be wrong as little as 24 hours in advance. Are you telling me scientists ability to accurately predict the climate 10 years, 50 years, 100 years in advance is something other than pure faith?
What explains the ABC news report in 2008 that quoted a particular global warming alarmist scientist that New york would be underwater in 2015?
http://eaglerising.com/19641/remember-when-in-2008-abc-predicted-global-catastrophe-by-2015-because-of-global-warming/
When you start making predictions about the future and acting and making decisions, like they will come true, that is a religion of pure faith. Its as simple as that.
My example above is just one scientist being grossly wrong on global warming.
what about the scientists, before global warming was trendy, predicted the ice age?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhoB-Vf0N08
Kevin,
So you do support abandoning the early warning systems that rely on “pure faith”? You can give one example of a scientist being wrong and I can give thousands of examples of scientists being right. I going to side with the data based research that protects human life over profit. It’s the Christian thing to do.
FF,
(Gave you 2 examples of scientists being totally wrong, can point out many, many more.)
Scientists can be wrong? Wow. Bold admission. Who pays the price for listening to a scientist that is wrong? (Answer the dipsticks that followed his religion.)
When you learn that “scientist” doomsday predictions are a dime a dozen, and we should stop worshipping these prediction like a religion and organizing our entire life around these false prophets…that is the problem. Liberals criticize religious cults for predicting the end of the world all the time….why do liberals always accept the false end of the world tripe from poor scientists?
It because liberals want to worship their religion on their version of the end of the world…no matter what the cost: starvation, and destruction of standard of living.
“Protecting life over profit” is an interesting term when it comes to poor science. There was an “environmental scientist” over the weekend that says the world sustainable population is 1 billion. What does that mean? 75% of us need to be eliminated? Its the same liberal 60s science prediction population bomb crap all over again, everyone was going to be starving by 1980 and we were going to run out of oil as well! Turns out that obesity and oil supply abundance are the problem of 2015.
Listening to doomsday “science” sayers are just as wrong in the scientific community as they are in the religious community. All these end of the world, doom and gloom religion need to be tossed from the public school religion.
Take your religions outside the public square.
I can say that my religion, Evangelical Christianity, is correct. Liberals religions are littered with a litany of proven false religions.
Kevin,
Once again, you have failed to prove a damn thing. Pointing fingers, calling names, justifying “your” religion and self glorification do not have any bearing on “actual science”. Nice distraction technique but has nothing to do with supporting your previous statement nor does it disprove mine.
Kevin,
How many religions does the WELS cult allow it’s members to worship?
How do we know that Jesus actually said what Mathew says he said?
Pat,
1.) WELS is not a cult, so that question is impossible to answer. It’s like asking me how many liberals support 1st amendment while wanting to sift free speech for a religious component. That is just as much as a nonsensical.
2.) Because bible is inerrant Word of God.
Kevin, so if WELS isn’t a cult, what is it?
And what proof do we have that the bible is the inerrant word of God?
1.) Christian Church.
2.) As posted on WELS web site about the bible:
“What is true and what is not true? The Bible is God’s Word. Not believing some of the Bible will lead to doubting all the Bible. The Bible is not a collection of human ideas and thoughts. The Bible is God’s Word, given word for word by the Holy Spirit to human writers. If any part of the Bible is merely human thoughts, and not God’s Word, then all of God’s Word can’t be trusted. If it is God’s Word, then all of it is true and is to be believed.
We believe the entire Bible is God’s Word and it is true. Our belief is not founded on shaky ground. First, there is more evidence for the documents of the Bible than for any other ancient book. Second, all the writers of the New Testament wrote within the first century of Christ’s birth. They all knew Jesus. Third, even historical facts cited by the writers have been proven to be true. Fourth, God promised that the writers would tell the truth. The Holy Spirit guided them so that they did just that.
We believe all of the Bible because in it God tells us that he loves us sinful human beings so very much that he sent His Son Jesus to live, suffer, die and rise for us so that we could be with him in heaven. That is why God tells us that his words “are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name” (John 20:31).
God’s Word is all true. You can trust every word of it from beginning to end.”
Kevin,
Ok, I’ll assume that what you are a member of holds their meetings in a building you call a church and everyone there considers themselves christians. I’ll also assume that you consider WELS a religion.
So with that, does your membership and participation in the WELS allow for you to be a member and participate in worship of other religions?
Are you saying God personally wrote the bible?
No
and
Yes
Kevin,
The one big religion that you belong to, and participate in full worship of, is the religion of Capitalism.
Pat,
I have to feed my kids.
The Bible has excellent advice about money and investing and using God’s blessings to the best of your ability.
Capitalism and Christianity are excellent when they are practiced together, especially in the area of cheerful giving.
Kevin,
So participating in the worshiping of the religion of Capitalism is ok with WELS. I thought that WELS didn’t allow for you to worship any other religion. What other religions are ok with WELS for you to participate and worship in?
Sacrificing human dignity for greed and gluttony are not part of Gods design.
Pat,
Participating in Capitalism is fine as long as its done with your Christianity at your core.
Matthew 25: 14-30
Its a sin not to use the financial blessings you are entrusted to invest and help others.
The servant that buried his 1 talent in the dirt represents the socialist not using his blessings he is trusted with in my opinion.
How did he help others?
Socialism is never about “cheerful giving” as Apostle Paul wrote about so many times.
So Capitalism is fine as long as one has the Holy Spirit swell within.
Capitalism does not sacrifice human dignity, it improves it. Liberals and socialism destroy human dignity.
Kevin,
So WELS approves of it’s members participation in, and worship of, other religions. I thought you said they didn’t???
Kevin,
I didn’t put capitalism in my sentence with greed and gluttony. That must have been a subliminal (Freudian) connection on your part. However and since you brought it up, I will try to give some examples. Walmart keeping the majority of its staff at part time to avoid paying benefits directly effects the workers health and human dignity. They also don’t pay a living wage. Even worse the Walmart owners (Walton’s) are Evangelical Christians and ignore the struggles of their employees. The criticisms of one of these biggest examples of capitalism are endless and many are rooted in truth. I can link capitalism to the sacrifice of human dignity going back hundreds of years. I’ll start at slavery and continue to New York sweat shops. I could include Native Americans and those Gulf Coast residents still trying to figure out how to clean up from the “spill”. Capitalism is essential and I’m all for it but sacrifices are made to human dignity. It’s the price we pay. Ignoring and denying this fact or trying to justify it with religion shows how secluded and out of touch some people really are with reality. Please entertain me and give examples of how liberals and socialism destroy human dignity.
Pat,
In my statement, I said capitalism is fine as long as one maintains their Christianity at their core.
That means servant leadership and good stewardship of blessings God has entrusted you.
That is worship of Christ in action, not capitalism.
There are many who have tossed their Christianity at their core and worship capitalism. Even then, many if those misguided souls realize they need to provide a good or service to others to get what they want. A form of servant leadership, albeit for their own ends.
That is still more moral than socialism and liberalism on any level.
You accuse me of throwing my Christianity out in worship of capitalism as I describe in 4th paragraph. If I have done that, I’d be willing to listen to your SPECIFIC Matthew 18 correction, talk about it, and take corrective action.
Fair warning, in case you don’t read your bible, that would require you to admit your Christianity in the process of correcting me under Matthew 18.
FF,
How socialism destroys human dignity?
Stalin
Mao
Ho Chi
Hugo Chavez
Castro
North Korea
FEMA
Veterans administration
Bureau of Indian affairs
Shall I go on?
I could type forever on evils of all powerful big government socialism.
Kevin,
Then is Capitalism a religion?
Kevin,
I thought we were talking about the United States of America. You said “capitalism does not sacrifice human dignity, it improves it. Liberals and socialism destroy human dignity”. How have (specifically) Liberals and socialism within the United States sacrificed human dignity? Merely saying FEMA isn’t exactly telling and leaves way to much room for interpretation. I’m assuming you don’t want to acknowledge the examples of sacrificed human dignity in the name of capitalism I provided?
Pat,
For some, Capitalism is their religion.
For me, Christianity is.
For nearly every lefty socialist, worship of big government is their religion.
My “beef” is, why are lefty religions allowed to permeate public schools.
FF,
I don’t claim capitalism doesn’t have its minor challenges when people act badly. Especially those outside Christian faith in action.
However, compared to the litany of human murder/human rights violations socialism produced in the 20th century, people would rather live under capitalism and freedom any day of the week.
When gates are down, people flee socialism toward capitalism. It’s as simple as that.
Why don’t people flee for socialism? That answer is all you need to know, people are smart when it comes to their well being. They don’t flee to oppressive socialist societies.
The public schools that are systematically being picked apart. The public schools that are slowly being dismantled. The public schools that will eventually be converted into private for profit schools in the name of capitalism and indoctrinated with Christianity. Kevin, didn’t you go to public school?
Kevin,
That was a yes or no question.
Is Capitalism a religion?
Greed and gluttony are byproducts of capitalism and not part of Gods design.
Pat,
Certainly, for some it is.
If you are implying it is a religion for me, well, I thought I made that clear.
FF,
Yes, went to public school for high school and college. So I’ve been to both private Christian and public. It gives me a complete perspective just how lost public schools are when it come to educating the spirit of the child.
Greed is a problem in capitalism, for those that do not hold their Christian faith in action, but capitalism also produces an astounding amount of giving, concern for one’s fellow man, and motivation to serve one’s fellow man, as well as the wealth to do all these things. Socialism discourages wealth, indicidual concern for one’s neighbor (“its the governments job to care”), and destroys motivation and innovation for the small business owner.
Capitalism, with Christianity in full action, is the most ideal economic system we can strive for on this earth.
Kevin,
It’s either a religion or it’s not.
Yes or no?
Kevin,
I was fortunate enough to go to public, private and Christian schools as a minor. As an adult I attended public and private universities. Never and I mean never did any public school or university teacher or professor force liberal religion down my throat. English is English, math is math, science is science etc, etc. I know you will argue that science in public schools teaches evaluation but I didn’t experience that. Biology was biology, physics was physics and chemistry was chemistry. Earth science was earth science and astronomy was astronomy. Nobody ever tried to discredit creationism nor did they try to force evaluation. Evaluation was not offered as a course. They taught directly from the lesson plans established by the departments (English, math, science etc.) and approved by the school districts and the state. The liberal religions you speak of are myths created out of fear of suppression of “your” religion. The spirit of a child should be nurtured at home, in the church and/or at a Christian school of your choice. Public classrooms shouldn’t be a pulpit for any religion. If we allow Christianity into the classroom soon we will have to allow Islam into the classroom. Equality works both ways. Or do you propose discriminating against other religions to further “your” religious goals.
Are you suggesting capitalism doesn’t work without Christianity in full action?
FF,
That’s fascinating response coming from someone who thinks a simple religious theme T-shirt is unacceptable for a Village Board meeting.
I’m suggesting Capitalist abuses only occur from the lack of Christianity in practice.
Kevin,
There is no such thing as a simple religious theme. You would be livid if a Kewaskum board member wore a T-shirt with Muhammad saying praise Allah.
There was no lack of Christianity behind Capitalist slavery. As a matter of fact, Christians liked to cite the following from the bible to justify the sacrifice of human dignity: “slaves obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling” (Ephesians 6:5) and “tell slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect” (Titus 2:9). The latter was also used to justify the raping of women and girls.
Once again your inability to separate your religion from politics has blurred reality. Wait, I forgot, you can separate the two but only when it suits your needs. Let’s ask the citizens of Detroit or Flint Michigan what Capitalism did to their human dignity.
Kevin,
So, am I to understand that data based science predictions are pretend science (fortune telling) and not good enough to consider for the purpose of saving human life? Yet, data based science predictions used to dictate our financial markets are okay because they “may” produce profit. You do invest in our Capitalistic financial markets (Dow Jones, S&P etc.) with your Christianity at the core… Don’t you?
“When you start making predictions about the future and making decisions, like they will come true, that is a religion of pure faith. It’s as simple as that.”
“If your life revolves around the guess of the fortune telling, that’s when it becomes a religion.”
Once again, a double standard with manipulated Christianity at the core.
FF,
I would not be livid, because I recognize free speech, no matter how stupid the speech is.
Slavery in biblical times and slavery in the 18th and 19th century American sense is a whole study in and of itself. Slavery in Jesus time was because people could not pay debts. This was vastly different than the slavery in the evil sense it was done in early America. Those who said they were Christian and supported slavery are like those Christians who support abortion. They say they are Christian but their actions say a whole other thing. Those who support killing, abusing, or torturing their fellow human being are NOT Christian. They can claim they are, but their actions expose there hollow Christianity.
Define “data based prediction” and maybe we can have a reasonable discussion about it.
Kevin,
Do you invest in U.S. financial markets? Market analysts, investors and financial advisors all rely on data based predictions (fortune telling) to manage investments in the markets. Why do you place faith in these predictions and not in ones related to saving human life. By your definition this would qualify as a religion. Similar to those practiced by Liberals.
Justify slavery at any time and any way you like it’s still wrong. If you think slavery in biblical times was “because people could not pay debts” you really do need to go back to school. That’s just another manipulation of the bible. Even a Christian school would acknowledge slavery existed in many forms and in many areas of the world through out history.
You don’t recognize free speech. You try on a daily basis to silence Liberals. You are willing to force Christianity into public schools and the public square to suppress their right to free speech. The only speech you are willing to tolerate is speech that agrees with the teachings of WELS. You don’t even tolerate other Christians that aren’t members of WELS.
Kevin,
Do you invest in U.S. financial markets (Dow Jones, S&P etc.)?
FF,
Of course I do, but I don’t claim my investing decision predictions to be a “science” either and I don’t force make others to depend on my “investing” predictions.
Hypocritical nonsense from every angle. Get a grip!
FF,
If your investing decisions are a “science” when it comes to prediction, please share, I’m on board!
I’m always looking for a no risk, big return investing strategy.
Kevin,
The models designed and used to predict hurricanes are similar to those used to reduce risk in the market. Numbers are part of science. Science literacy is obviously not one of your strong suits. “Science appeals to our rational brains, but our beliefs are motivated largely by emotion and the biggest motivation is remaining tight with our peers.”
Again, you have tried to spin, manipulate and distort your way out of this debate. I never claimed my investment decisions were science. My point was that you accept pretend science “fortune telling” when it comes to profit but deny it when it comes to saving human life. It’s one more example of the hypocrisy that makes up your irrational thought process and your willingness to fit in with a group of politicians that don’t even want you. Try forming some thoughts of your own instead of continually mimicking and echoing those who don’t care about human life only profit.
By the way, how did you acquire the $750,000 in net worth and the $1,100,000 in start up costs required to purchase your first DQ franchise? Did you save it working as a DQ employee or inherit it? Is it the American dream of capitalism if it’s handed to you?
Kevin,
I am not claiming to be an expert on any of this. However, time series forecasting, stochastic jump process, machine learning, random walk hypothesis, complexity science, computer data sources, fundamental and technical analysis are all used to predict (fortune telling) the stock market as well as aiding in the prediction of weather, earthquakes and medicine (seizures). These are just a few examples of science based and data driven models being used. Many have been (and continue to be) used beginning in the 1980’s to predict, with a high level of accuracy, the increases in global temperatures that have turned out to be true over the past 30 years. Deny all you want but the proof is in the science… And numbers. This is “actual science” and science that you are willing to risk your money on. To bad you aren’t willing to save human life with it.
FF,
As a finance major all those things are nice, but fail to reduce investment prediction to a science.
The equation always results in: more risk, usually generates more reward. Less risk usually always means less reward.
There are advance strategies you can employ such as straight put, straight calls(both long and short), ratio call/put spreads, strangles, back ratio call/put spreads, straight call/put spreads both long and short to eliminate risk on underlying stock, security, or future (which you can also be long or short on)…but prediction about future and direction of any particular stock, futures contract, or overall market is still “best guess”. There is no real “science” to future prediction.
The only real sound advice about future prediction I found useful in investing experience is: Cut losses short, Let winners run. Intellectually it sounds easy, but emotionally difficult to do. (No one ever wants to be wrong, so people tend to hang onto losers twice as long as winners…should be other way around.)
Point is: Climate prediction is just as much of a guess. To put your faith in a future guess and act on it with your time and money, is a internal cosmology on your part, not science.
Borrowed up to my eyeballs to finance my restaurant. Once I got that clear, had to borrow again to remodel. Still owe about 1/2 of borrowed amount on that. When you are a finance major, 100% finance is possible on anything….which equals LARGE risk….trust me on that one!
Kevin,
I get all that but the real question remains… Why are you willing to risk your money on “pretend science” (fortune telling) but fail to accept the possibility that the same “pretend science” may save human life. If there is a chance even one life could be saved wouldn’t it be worth it. Remember when (mid-1990’s) some people and some corporations(RJ Reynolds) denied cigarettes caused cancer and other ailments. This is the perfect example of Capitalism knowingly sacrificing human dignity for greed and gluttony. Every one had the data, research and physical evidence but profit drove denial. Climate change/global warming is exactly the same. It always comes down to the greed of the wealthy few vs. the truth and well being of the world. Should I ignore years of research, data, proven hypothesis and huge amounts of published evidence by educated scientists in favor of your conclusions reached by you sitting on the couch speculating? Your false equivalence and scientifically unsupported viewpoints based on unfiltered dribble scrounged up on the internet is no substitute for “actual science”.
Kevin,
Why not answer my simple yes or no question? Please give a one word, yes or no, response to my question if capitalism is a religion.
Pat,
For third time. Yes, some people see Capitalism as a religion. Is it my religion? No.
If the point is: We should then throw Capitalism and the free market out of public school curriculum…well, that has already been done by the big government worshippers who largely run public schools.
Kevin,
So your answer is yes, capitalism is a religion, just as WELS is a religion.
Thanks.
“Yes, some people see Capitalism as a religion. Is it my religion? No.”
Thank you, Kevin. I believe you. Why don’t you extend the same courtesy to others when they tell you what is and is not their religion?
Major,
Just because others don’t see it as a religion, does not mean its not a religion.
That’s why its so dangerous to sift and sort speech for a religious “shut-up” component…
Nearly every radical leftist worth his salt will declare Capitalism a religion. Just as every conservative will declare the grungy, unshowered, Occupy Wall Street protestors diciples in the anti-globalism religion.
Where do we censor first in the public schools?
That is what liberalism has come to and why it is so dangerous to free thought and expression of any kind at any moment in time.
“Just because others don’t see it as a religion, does not mean its not a religion.”
In other words, ‘I am right and everyone else is wrong’. Great argument there, champ.
That’s the most hypocritical statement Kevin has ever made. Thanks Kevin!… You just proved my point about every argument you have ever made with ONE comment.
Major,
That is the same argument (“I am right, everyone else is wrong”) used by liberals to suppress religious speech in the public square. The problem is, “what exactly is religious speech? The everyday life wisdom in Proverbs and Psalms is out? Only some of it? all of it?
I want the lefty religions out of the public square too. That’s all I’m saying.
FF,
I’ll bite, which one of my statements is “hypocritical”?
Kevin says he does what liberals do. He criticizes liberal tactics, but turns around and does the same. In my book that makes him no better then those he criticizes and thus, a hypocrite. And now he’ll more than likely whip out a bible quote to rationalize his hypocritical behavior.
“And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by men. Truly, I say to you they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room (or closet.) and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret…” (Matthew 6:5-6 RSV).
Matthew 6:1
Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.
Jude 1:16
These are grumbles, malcontents, following their own sinful desires: they are loud mouthed boasters, showing favoritism to gain advantage.
FF,
I try to practice righteousnes, through the Holy Spirit, as a matter of the way I live my life, not in a manner where I’m concerned about others seeing it. In other words, I don’t “hold up” doing the good deeds that flow from the Holy Spirit to wait until someone sees the deeds. Sometimes others may see the good deed as a consequence of how I go about my day, but it is not intentional on my part that others see it. If you have a a specific example where I have done this (withheld good works in order to wait for it to be seen by others), I’d be willing to listen to your Matthew 18 correction and talk about it.
The verse before Jude 1:16, Jude 1:15 is refering to the ungodly (in word and deed) who deny Christ as their Savior. Jude 1:16 is decribing deniers of Christ. Again, if you have a specific example of where I have denied Christ, I’m willing to listen to your Matthew 18 correction and talk about…and, if needed, make correction.
Pat,
I pray on my own. I also pray in church, not because I love others to see me pray, but because:
Hebrews 10: 24-25
24 And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds, 25 not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.
I don’t go to church to worry about whether others see me pray. I go to church to strengthen and build my faith and hopefully encourage others in the faith. Again, if you have an specific instance where this applies, or I’ve stated that I worry about how others perceive my prayer, I’d be willing to listen to correction under Matthew 18 and discuss it, if needed, make correction.
Kevin,
But you want your faith, displayed as prayer, as you perceive it, presented in the public square and in the public schools. Does this not go against the teachings of Jesus?
I’ve been here before with some of you. As far as Kevin is concerned, he does not know what religion is because he cannot distinguish it from things which are not religion.
So, when I say “I don’t want the government making religious statements because the government should be secular.” He might get that point. Might. IF he were able to understand that things I do want the government to do–like teach science–aren’t religion. He conflates these things in order for his argument to make sense. When I don’t want his nativity scene at the public courthouse, he feels unfairly discriminated against because public school teachers get to teach evolution.
The whole thing really is held together by a bizarre and willful misunderstanding about the simplest thing: what is and is not religion.
Pat,
I don’t want my faith displayed for my gain “a look at me, and how faithful I am”. Christ commands to go make disciples of all nations. The glory and absolute truth are his. It’s clear liberal Gaylor, disciples of Satan, are attempting to block that the best they can, legally.
Either we should stop filtering speech for a religious “shut up” component or we start doing it for the church of liberalism as well. That’s all I ask, free speech for all or free speech as the liberals treat Christians.
Scott,
You keep saying that, but can I put everyday common wisdom in Psalms and Proverbs for daily inspiration at bottom of my public official email? Religious? Verboten? Or not verboten?
Proverbs 12:10 verboten as religious or do you advocate animal cruelty by banning it as “religious”.
If Proverbs 12:10 is dandy with leftist as “non religious”, is there a secret list of verboten, not verboten parts of bible in public square.
You will refuse to answer this because it makes you look like a speech censor no matter how you slice it…..or maybe your anti-free speech position does not bother you at all.
Kevin,
You are free to practice your religion as your church dictates.
Kevin,
How many black people belong to “your” church? If I wanted to become a member what is the process.
Pat,
Free exercise of religion in our society is under attack. You are incorrect that Christians get free exercise in our society. Remember FF, he says he has to screen my free speech T-shirts to Village Board meetings for a religious component and make sure they are properly censored.
FF,
First step is to contact myself, or a pastor, or a leadership Team member and we will discuss the process with you. Generally, if you have a good backround in Christianity and understand basic biblical teachings, we may accept someone as a member by a simple confession of faith. However, if you come from a non-Christian backround, an instruction course suited to your schedule can be scheduled.
We are a communion of saints in Christ. If the race of your fellow saint in Christ matters to you, may I suggest another church.
Kevin,
Are you saying you are unable to practice your religion according to what the WELS church dictates? Please give specific examples.
Pat,
FF says I can’t wear “Jesus, don’t leave earth without him” T-shirt to Village Board. Some here agree with him.
I’ve long debated with several people here about putting everyday inspiration at bottom of my email for Village board matters (both using private email or my public email) using Psalms and Proverbs. Many here decalre that verboten.
Here is the specific list of religious hostility against Christians. (both my examples above could easily fit into some of these scenarios):
http://www.religioushostility.org/
The question is: do I dare utilize my right to free speech and speak biblical inspiration….or is the liberal threat enough of a “chill” to my free speech that I shouldn’t do either suggestion above?
I think the anti free speech liberal “chill” is present after you read the entire report at link above.
That is the legacy of what Tammy Baldwin is advocating. That is why, what she said is so disgusting to a free society.
Liberals should be calling for Baldwin to resign. ….but crickets.
Kevin,
Why do you let FF tell you what you can or can’t wear. Just put on that t-shirt and go to your meeting.
You didn’t give any specific examples religious practices that the WELS church sanctions that you can’t practice. Do you have any?
Kevin,
Can an employee of yours wear a t-shirt at work, that is visible for all to see, that says, “”Jesus, don’t leave earth without him”?
Kevin,
It is to bad as a public official you don’t realize that many of your constituents aren’t Christians and don’t share your views about Jesus. I never said you couldn’t wear your shirt I said that the supreme court has determined the separation of church and state to be constitutional. The problem is you are willing to ignore the law of the land in preference for your personal beliefs. I also said that as a public official I would think you would dress more appropriately then a T-shirt. You love trying to drag me back into the mix but as I have repeatedly shown, it’s far to easy for me to show the errors of your ways. The problem is your arrogance and ignorance makes it impossible for you to see. I’m not sure if others believe you can handle yourself in these debates or if they refuse to come to your defense for other reasons. I’m leaning to the latter. Either way, I’m about done beating this dead horse that continually blames everyone else and never takes any responsibility. It must be great being so perfectly correct all the time even when everyone else sees the wrong. By the way, how many black people are members of “your” church? If I wanted to become a member what is the process?
Pat,
Kevin will respond by saying: they have to wear the DQ sanctioned uniform. Maybe the question should be can a police officer, a fire man or the secretary at the village hall wear a T-shirt will working that says “Praise Allah – To hell with Jesus” with a picture of Muhammad carrying a machine gun?
Pat,
If my employees wanted to wear that T-Shirt at work. I’d be all for it.
FF,
See post above for my response on membership and race.
No police officer, village employee, would ever wear that shirt because liberals would be so perpetually offended, given their reaction to confederate flag, the outrage would be swift to get that out of public square. I’m almost certain liberals would be more offended at that, then the confderate flag worn by a public official, if liberals are intellectually honest about their offense.
Kevin,
You’d be all for it, but would you allow it?
You didn’t give any specific examples religious practices that the WELS church sanctions that you can’t practice. Do you have any?
Kevin,
The question remains, would YOU allow or be okay with any village employee wearing such a shirt? If you think reaction to the confederate flag was swift I think many black people over the last 150 years that would disagree. One more time, how many black members do you have at “your” church? I notice you keep avoiding answering this question.
Pat,
Yes, I would allow a “Jesus: don’t leave earth without him” T-shirt at work.
FF,
I wouldn’t let village staff threaten violence while on the job. Mohammed with a machine gun on a shirt falls into that category.
As I stated above:
“We are a communion of saints in Christ. If the race of your fellow saint in Christ matters to you, may I suggest another church.”
I don’t bother asking my fellow Christian in my church what their race is. It does not matter to me. Why would it matter to you?
We have many members of various ethnic backrounds, I don’t spearate them and count them by skin color.
Why do you?
Kevin,
How many black people are members of “your” church? You shouldn’t have to ask if someone is black or Asian, it should be obvious. I’m assuming there is a reason why you are avoiding answering this question. I’m surprised you don’t know the demographics of your own church. Is your congregation that large? How many members at your church?
Remove the machine gun, even though gun advocates would argue that gun images and even guns themselves don’t threaten violence or cause violence, now you have a picture of Muhammad saying “Praise Allah – To Hell with Jesus”. Would you allow or be okay with a village employee wearing that shirt?
Kevin,
Could an employee wear a scarf the said “Jesus: don’t leave earth without him”?
I’m also still waiting for specific examples of religious practices that the WELS church sanctions that you can’t practice.
Kevin, putting a Bible quote in the signature of your official government email is just douchy. Putting up religious symbols in government buildings is where people like me start thinking about litigation. It’s government speech I’m interested in, not yours. Another easy-to-understand distinction that you apparently find baffling. I don’t care if you paint yourself blue and call yourself a druid. But I don’t want you to erect Christ the Redeemer in front of city hall.
Pat,
Scarf, no, because of safety getting caught in equipment.
See Scott’s post for WELS sanctioned things I can’t practice. He’s already threatening litigation if I just talk everyday inspiration.
(but of course he would never leave me a list of “verboten”, “non verboten”.)
What Scott just said is the type of free speech “chill” of everyday thoughts and ideas I’m talking about.
Who do you run by every thought and sentence for a “religious” sanitation content?
That’s why Baldwin, and the secret police ilk, that agree with her are the most dangerous thing we face in this society right now.
FF,
It just chaps you that I don’t care about skin color, doesn’t it? Why do you care about skin color? I only see a fellow Christian when I interact with a fellow church member.
Easy to tell from outward appearance? Hilarious. Liberals in NAACP couldn’t tell a white women was running their outfit for years!
Kevin,
There is no diversity at “your” church. I have attended, twice (wife’s family) and never saw one person of color. Its hard to see skin “color” because they are all white. There wasn’t anyone even close to being of color. It’s funny how you don’t see skin color when talking to a Christian but unless that Christian is a member of “your” church you don’t even recognize them as Christian. Remember, they are Christians in name only. I don’t work at the NAACP but I’m sure by outward appearance I would be able to get a sense of the demographics. Doesn’t chap me at all about what you care about or don’t care about. Simply wanted to see how much effort you’d put not avoiding a question I already knew the answer to. I also wanted to show what a closed community you surround yourself with yet you believe you have all the answers to things you have never even been exposed to. So, do you have any demographics information I might have missed during my two visits to “your” church?
What about the other question… If there is no machine gun, would you allow or be okay with a village employee wearing a T-shirt that says “Praise Allah-To Hell With Jesus”? If you believe you should have your right to express your beliefs why shouldn’t an employee with different views have the same rights to express their beliefs.
Oh… at some point in the future we can revisit your comment about an image of a machine gun falling into the category of threatening violence. Since you are a gun rights advocate we should have great fun exploring that comment.
Kevin said, “Who do you run by every thought and sentence for a “religious” sanitation content?”
Huh?
Are you or are you not able to practice your WELS religion?
I’m all for you wearing a tshirt with “Jesus: don’t leave earth without him”, on it anywhere you want. I’m all for you standing at the intersection of Hwy45 & 28 and preaching up a storm. Have you done either of these? Have you stood outside your Dairy Queen and preached?
Have you put an expression of your love for God on the bottom of your official letters?
If not, why not.
Pat,
Have worn T-shirt to Village Board.
Have not used daily inspiration at bottom of my email.
Just contemplating. Just curious how much censorship there is out there with our local lefties. Clear to me, there is a lot of liberal censorship running around with legal threats over simple free speech and ideas.
The safe route probably is: I better line up my free speech legal team before I attempt to put simple daily inspiration at bottom of my email.
Sad that liberals have reduced our society to this. That is legacy of Gaylor and Baldwin.
Kevin,
Have you stood on the corner of hwy28 & 45 and preached? Have you stood in the parking lot and preached to the customers as they arrive?
I’ve seen a street preacher in West Bend in the court yard preaching up a storm in the past.
FF,
So your worship experience is dependant on whether you can spot minorities?
Why don’t you introduce yourself to me and I can introduce you to a staff member who you would classify as “African American”….not sure, because I never really asked her ethnicity in 10 years she has been on staff, and I really don’t care what her ethnicity is. All that matters is that she is a great Christian Day School teacher (to all of my kids) and she leads by example in her faith.
I can also introduce you to our many outstanding organists in the congregation, one of whom is Hispanic.
I’m certain I can introduce you to other “minority” members, but I would have to check with them first if they are comfortable being introduced to someone judging by skin color. That kind of thing makes people uncomfortable to those of us that consider ourselves a communion of saints in Christ, where skin color does not mattter.
Pat,
Have you seen my truck? Wherever I go I’m preaching just by driving around.
Have I stood at 28 & 45? No.
I have invited people to church at DQ, and some have taken up invitation. Have I discussed Jesus with customers from time to time, and sat down with them to talk about the gospel if interested? Yes. So if that fits into your “parking lot” narrative, then sure.
The way Baldwin talks….these things all sound verboten.
A street preacher on cornor is not always the most effective way to reach people…its also not exactly my God given talent either.
Kevin,
Then I don’t know what you’re complaining about. It sounds like your able to do what you want to do.
Kevin,
It just chaps you that I question how closed minded you are. So, the membership of those people of color is less then 1% and you have a couple of underpaid staff members of color. Sounds like the diversity only found in a community of Christians that doesn’t even accept other Christians. Discrimination is at the root of many of your beliefs. Whether it’s people in Milwaukee, Muslims, liberals or Christians in name only, you have found a way to legitimize your discrimination with your religious beliefs. More shameful is you are willing to ignore the teachings of your church to further your politics or to make a profit.
Would you allow or is it okay for a village employee to wear a T-shirt that says “Praise Allah – To Hell With Jesus”?
Did you wear your Jesus shirt under your dress shirt or did you actually participate as a board member at a village meeting wearing a t shirt?
Pat,
At least until someone comes thumping to enfocre the Baldwin anti-free exercise of religion standard.
FF,
You are too much in making me laugh. How many times did I say skin color does not matter when we are one in Christ? At least 4 times by my count.
You are the one that cares about skin color, not me.
If there is discrimination in this conversation, it is on your side of the conversation.
I’m for growing the congregation by adding members, no matter what their skin color.
Hardly a sign of discrimination on my part.
I only discriminate when it comes to good and evil.
Kevin,
Treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction against a person or thing based on the group , class or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit is discrimination. Showing favoritism, one-sidedness, bias or intolerance can led to unjust treatment of others.
My point isn’t about skin color, it’s about the closed community from which you preach.
WOULD YOU ALLOW OR IS IT OKAY FOR A VILLAGE EMPLOYEE TO WEAR A T-SHIRT THAT SAYS “PRAISE ALLAH – TO HELL WITH JESUS”?
How did you wear your shirt? Under your dress shirt?
Kevin,
Do you support this statement? “The notion that a free-thinking American should be discriminated against simply for expressing a perspective that is in conflict with another is patently un-American and flies in the face of true tolerance and civility”
The thing about people like Kevin is if they were a religious minority they’d suddenly understand the fairness of keeping the government secular. But as long as they’re in the majority it isn’t in their interests to understand it. Weird thing is, keeping the government secular is the only thing that truly ensures religious liberty–Kevin’s and everyone else’s.
Scott,
Christianity is not in majority in this nation. That is a myth.
According to Barna group survey.
A full 37% of americans consider themselves “post-christian”. Add that to 15%-20% that were never Christian. Christians are in minority.
Of the remaining that would consider themselves Christian, a fair chunk, do not attend church, or attend church infrequently.
So Christianity is in minority status, not majority status, which should qualify christians for victimhood in liberal sphere. (Therefore, enjoy as much rights as you afford the liberal religions in public sphere.)
According to PEW Research the number of Americans that are Christian is 70.6%
Pat,
Barna is the most respected authority on Christian faith, church, attendence and trend in Christianity.
PEW has had a lot of incorrect polls in past.
If 37% of Americans consider themselves “post Christian” according to Barna, 70% of America cannot be Christian.
Barna is very respected in this area.
Kevin,
Barna has a slant toward the results they, and you, want to hear. PEW is non-partisan. Let’s have a show of hands and see you has a tendency to agree with PEW’s results versus Barna’s results.
And according to ABC 83% of Americans identify as Christians.
“Ask Americans their religion and you’ll get an earful — 50 individual answers in an ABCNEWS/Beliefnet poll, ranging from agnostics to Zen Buddhists. The vast majority, though, have something in common: Jesus Christ.
Eighty-three percent of Americans identify themselves as Christians. Most of the rest, 13 percent, have no religion. That leaves just 4 percent as adherents of all non-Christian religions combined — Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and a smattering of individual mentions.
That’s quite different from the world at large: Fifty-two percent of the world’s population is non-Christian, compared to 4 percent in the United States; and one-third is Christian, compared to 83 percent in the United States. (These are rough comparisons, because the world figures, reported by the Encyclopedia Britannica, are for the full population, while the U.S. figures are among adults only.)
This poll used an open-ended question to gauge religious affiliation: “What if anything is your religion?” Most of the 50 affiliations cited are Christian denominations, ranging from the Assembly of God to the United Church of Christ. Added up they show that 53 percent of Americans are Protestants, 22 percent Catholics and 8 percent other Christians, such as Mormons or Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Protestant Groups
The largest group within the ranks of American Protestants is unaffiliated: Nineteen percent of Americans say they’re Protestants, but don’t cite a specific denomination. They account for more than a third of all Protestants.
Another 15 percent of Americans identify themselves as Baptists or Southern Baptists, meaning this group accounts for nearly three in 10 Protestants. No other Protestant denomination comes close in size.
Baptists are especially prevalent among black Americans: Nearly half of blacks, 48 percent, say they’re Baptists, making it far and away their No. 1 denomination (next are nondenominational, at 15 percent of blacks, and Methodist, at 8 percent of blacks). Among whites, 22 percent are Catholics, another 22 percent are nonaffiliated Protestants and 13 percent are Baptists.
Blacks, who are overwhelmingly Christian, are also more likely than whites to have any religion: Just 3 percent of blacks say they have no religion, compared to 13 percent of whites. (“No religion” includes people who describe their religion as atheist or agnostic.)
Other Denominations
Six percent of Americans say they’re Methodists (including African Methodists and United Methodists); 5 percent, Lutherans. No other Protestant denomination was named by more than 2 percent of respondents.
Evangelicals
Thirty-seven percent of all Christians describe themselves as born-again or evangelical; that includes nearly half of all Protestants (47 percent), as well as a small share (14 percent) of Catholics.
Baptists again dominate: Sixty-two percent of Baptists say they’re evangelical Christians, compared to 46 percent of all other Protestant denominations combined, and 37 percent of nondenominational Protestants.
Evangelism soars particularly among blacks, and southerners: Two-thirds of blacks describe themselves as evangelical or born-again Christians, double the share of whites who do so. And 55 percent of Christians in the South say they’re born-again, compared to 21 percent in the Northeast, 26 percent in the Midwest and 31 percent in the West.”
Gallup has three-quarters of Americans identifying as Christian.
Fox News reports, “Christianity is still the dominant faith by far in the U.S.; 7 in 10 Americans identify with the tradition.”
Kevin,
You are avoiding my question like the plague. It really is a simple yes or no question.
Would you allow or is it okay for a village employee to wear a T-shirt that says “Praise Allah – To Hell With Jesus”?
As a defender of free speech and as someone who wants religion in the public sector you should have no problem answering this question. It also relates to my next question.
Do you support this statement? “The notion that a free thinking American should be discriminated against simply for expressing a perspective that is in conflict with another is patently un-American and flies in the face of true tolerance and civility”.
You don’t have to answer because I saw your signature added to the petition that contained this statement. I guess it’s just one more of your double standards or hypocrisies.
It’s scary that you believe Christians are a minority yet you want it introduced into the public sector.
Islamics are also a minority. Maybe we should indoctrinate our public schools with their religion.
I know plenty of faithful devoted Christians that don’t attend church regularly or at all. They have to deal with the realities of life. For example, being bed bound do to illness or living in a remote area. Some don’t like the politics of organized religion. For example, being expected to donate 10% (or more) of their earnings. This does not make them any less Christian. Not quite sure what that has to do with proving Christians are a minority.
Christians are a minority in the United States? That’s rich.
Kevin, the reason you feel victimized is because it hurts to have people take away your privilege. But you’re not a victim. You’ve just never noticed that you were privileged in the first place. You’re a white Christian man in America. If that’s not being born on second base I don’t know what is.
As a member of WELS Kevin does not recognize other denominations of Christianity. They are Christians in name only. Therefore, he truly believes his Christianity (WELS) is a minority religion.
I hope he’s right.
We can only pray!
FF,
After that ridiculous conversation on race issues in my church, I want to keep discussion on point. I’m certainly not going to indulge your proposed anti-Christian rhetoric.
Also, to clarify, WELS is not in fellowship with other denominations that have false teaching. WELS does not say we have “exclusiveness” to teaching in truth and purity. Others in other denominations may be saved, becaue they see through the fog of the false teaching. So it is flat out wrong for you to assert that WELS holds a position that the only Christians are WELS.
Christians, with true saving faith:
Stay in word and sacrament through regular use of means of grace by attending church and bible study regularly.
According to Barna, which is a deep dive into Christian issues.
Less than 1/3 of America falls into this category.
“Chirsitans in name only” are not Christians.
If we go with 83% figure, 50% of America is in a curious state of their Christianity.
When I use the term “Christian”, I mean Christians in action, not just people that use the label without living the gospel.
Kevin,
You never fail to amaze me. As I said before- you could spin maggot invested rotten meat into a rose decorated ice cream cake. Of course, now, you won’t indulge any of what you claim is anti-Christian rhetoric, now that I’m about to expose you as a hypocrite, who lives by double standards, one more time. Isn’t that the whole point of 99% of your posts. To confront (indulge) and use Matthew 18 to try to guide Christians and non Christians. Not indulging non Christian rhetoric will leave you with nothing to do. You better find a new hobby. As for WELS, the denominations WELS is in fellowship with are few and far between. Because “Fellowship” is determined by WELS and only if the other denomination follows the Teachings of WELS as interpreted in their “statement of belief”. WELS uses a “statement of belief” to distinguish itself from other denominations . This statement of belief is a non biblical summary or interpretation of Scripture. By it’s very nature it leaves some of Gods teachings out. Furthermore, the Apostles, the Athanasian, the Nicene as well as the Lutheran confessions contained in the Book of a Concord (which is held as worshipped text) are all products of man and liable to contain mistakes. Yet your church has elevated these documents to the same level as the Scriptures. Once again, my point had nothing to do with race issues in your church (glad to see you are calling the, “issues”) or with your church in general but was merely to show the closed community from which you preach. Twisting this again will only show deliberate ignorance.
Anyway, let’s do as you say and “keep the discussion on point”… “Tammy Baldwin Objects To a People Exercising their Religion”.
“The notion that a free thinking American should be discriminated against simply for expressing a perspective that is in conflict with another is patently un-American and flies in the face of true tolerance and civility” obviously only applies when you want it to or in the defense of a fellow Christian. A fellow Christian (Phil Robertson-Duck a Dynasty) who by the way isn’t a member of WELS or a church that shares “fellowship” with WELS. By your definition he would be a Christian in name only based on the false teaching of his denomination. I’m sure this is just another justifiable double standard in the world according to Kevin but feel free to explain. Both Owen and you are reading way to far into Baldwin’s statement (not defending Baldwin position) but even if your assumptions are true I would think Baldwin deserves the same considerations afforded others under your above quoted assertion. If not… double standard.
So Kevin how did you wear your Jesus T-shirt at the village meeting… Under your dress shirt?
Do you also wear your Batman Underoos under your pants?
Kevin,
I’ve never seen you silenced. Caught on a point? You said you wore your Jesus T-shirt to a village board meeting but I know you are a very professional person and I’m assuming you wouldn’t wear just a T-shirt to a village board meeting. So how did you wear your T-shirt… Under your dress shirt? Would you allow or is it okay for a village employee to wear a t-shirt that says “Praise Allah-Not Jesus” instead of “Praise Allah-To Hell With Jesus”? Just trying to figure out when it’s okay for a nonChristian to practice the same rights that you seek. If and when the separation of church and state is ended will the nonChristian have the same right to free expression that you seek within the village?