West Bend Schools Thinking About Operating Budget Referendum
And here we go.
The first draft of proposed 2010-11 budget recommendations for the West Bend School district began taking shape Tuesday night during a meeting of the Citizen Financial Advisory Committee.
Among the listed possible budget recommendations is an April 2010 operating referendum.
“I am not saying that we are going to recommend it,” said CFAC chairman Mark Lustig. “But it is something we have to throw out on the table.”
CFAC member John Grundahl said his preference would be that the referendum exceed the revenue limit for any subsequent year of less than two-thirds funding by state aid. The amount requested would be the difference between two-thirds of the current revenue limit and state aid received.
I heard rumblings of this a while ago. In the aftermath of a 10.9% tax increase and a teachers’ union that is asking for salary increases and domestic partner benefits (BTW, the domestic partner benefits have apparently been dropped, but we don’t yet know what the district gave them for it), some folks are seriously thinking of asking the voters for another referendum to jack up taxes.
For the uninitiated, let me break it down a bit. The Citizen Financial Advisory Committee (CFAC) is a committee of folks who are tasked with advising the school board on financial issues. Who is on it? How do you get on it? That’s a bit opaque. If you go to the district’s website, it says to contact Brian Dasher, but he’s out on an indefinite leave of absence. I do know many of the members and the vast majority of them are basically hacks for the school district. Teachers, union folks, etc… While CFAC was purportedly set up to be a citizen group to advise the district, you will find very few members who don’t have a financial stake in spending more of our money in the district.
So that’s the game… CFAC is set up to “advise” the district on financial matters. A strong majority of them are vested in the district taxing and spending more money. Word from their meeting last month is that the administration suggested that they would not put forth an operating budget referendum unless CFAC (wink, wink) recommended it. Now we have the recommendation being floated. It’s a farce.
The district should immediately put the kabash on any idea of another referendum, but I suspect that they won’t.
Why wait till April?? Listen we have “Book of the Month” “Beer of the Month”
“Pie of the Month”,
we NEED “Referendum of the Month” !!!Don’t be heartless—- It’s for the Kids…. Right??
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 09, 2009 at 1506 hrs
January 5th is the deadline for those interested in running for the two seats available in April. Two strong candidates could make quite a change if Stepanski finds the spine he once had.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 09, 2009 at 1721 hrs
Maybe another council should be formed as an independent body to give the taxpayers the real scoop instead of this body made of school teachers and administrators.
There are all kinds of groups - and there are plenty of taxpayers in West Bend…
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 09, 2009 at 1724 hrs
I hope my district considers such a move. If the voters approve it, we’ll get some relief from the crippling and degrading cuts that have hobbled our district and threatened to turn it into a shell of its former self. I hate what the state funding formula has done to our schools.
Posted by Mike on December 09, 2009 at 2041 hrs
Being at the meeting Tuesday night I was surprised to see what was printed in today’s paper. The story is not accurate. The April referendum topic was bought up and discussed, but in the end was dismissed. CFAC will not be recommending an April referendum. I am not a teacher, union “folk”, nor do I have any incentive to spend West Bend’s money. The goal is to become as informed as possible and make sound financial decisions for the community. Feel free to sit in on any meeting, they are open to the public.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 09, 2009 at 2227 hrs
It is disturbing when it appears that people ignore troubling problems like the FDIC going bankrupt and a homeless problem right in West Bend.
Posted by on December 10, 2009 at 0946 hrs
We have members of the union bargaining unit (teachers) advising the school board on financial matters? Is that not a conflict of interest if your hammering out a new contract?
I work with several people who are considering making an exodus from West Bend, except market conditions in housing at the time are not favorable. Industry has already left town will higher taxes keep people here?
The district Supt. spoke several months ago at rotary about referrendum # 2 for buildings and grounds, the statement posted by Karl that it wont happen in April may be true, but it will happen when is the question.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 1024 hrs
Get you in the Spirit of giving (MORE)!
Little Drummer boy.
We….. need more money, ref-er-en-dum……
We have to spend more money, ref-er-en–dum….
We…. will not make cuts to ad-min-is-tra-tion….
We won’t freeze pay or bennys, ref-er-end-um, ref-er-en-dum, ref-er-en-dum…..It’s…. for the kids, ref-er-en-dum….
We… won’t stop till we get more-of- your- cash……
Why do you disagree.. Don’t you care about schools,… care about schools,… care about schools…….We…. will cut the sports, ref-er-en-dum….
Fill in the Pool and have a, ref-er-en-dum…..
They’ll…. Be Free lunch for ad-min-is-tra-tors, ad-min-is-trators, ad-min-is-tratorsTax… em’ to the max, ref-er-en-dum……
Max…. the Levy out, ref-er-en-dum….
De…vide the community, ref-er-en-dum
Keep, keep our buddies happy ref-er-end-dum, ref-er-en-dum, ref-er-en-dum……….Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 1035 hrs
Which members of CFAC are teachers? i don’t think that there are any.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 1204 hrs
TTTM - ROFL!
Posted by GAMazy on December 10, 2009 at 1219 hrs
Crusher,
Where are these people going to move? Where the “School District” taxes are lower? Going North? They’ll then get less for the buck. Moving out to the countryside maybe? Whatever, forget those questions. What specific taxes are the issue? For myself in a modest home, city taxes are currently $300 more that the district’s tax. Grothman told the Common Sense Citizens of WC at Lighthouse Lanes that the economy and Madison is the culprit.The Common Sense Citizens of WC code of “Personal Responsibility” means get one’s self educated on what’s going rather than just leeching Owen’s selected snapshots.
Integrity is choosing dialog vs couch potato, beer gut ignorant monolog.Property located in WB
Total Assessed Value 179,700
Fair Market Value 193,300taxing jurisdiction 2008 2009 %change
state 32.96 32.81 .5-
county 526.31 536.71 2+
WB-City 1,523.42 1,533.87 .7+
WBS 1,101.50 1,233.44 12.2+
MPTC 260.76 267.89 2.7+
Totals 3,384.05 3,493.11 3.2+school levy tax reduced by school levy tax credit: 209.53
Yeh, don’t forget to point out that the stimulus is paid for by Obama-conspiracy-theory tax dollars as if we are all idiots!
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 1322 hrs
What happens of the district in WB does put a operating budget referendum on the ballot? How would folks here interpret a victory at the polls for such a scenario? How would they interpret a defeat?
If the voters approve such a referendum, does that mean that the greedy teachers and the dim-wit school board is just stickin it to the little guy? Or does it mean that the citizens of WB recognize the need to reinvest in their schools?
If it fails does that mean the electorate is legitimately expressing fiscal conservatism? Or does it mean WB is being manipulated by talk radio and doomsday bloggers who think any new taxes are wasteful and one more step in the march towards Marxism?
Trust the democratic process and determine for yourselves…
Posted by Mike on December 10, 2009 at 1432 hrs
Anon aka Penterman, How do I know tis you? as not many teachers use there lunch period to log on and recite stats.
I guess you would like it if I took to heart everything that was printed in the local paper or distributed on the school web site, you know the places that you have some type of control over, and it just makes me a leech if I want to expand my horizons and read or think an alternative view, one that differs from yours. Just sucks when you have no control on the public.
I have never attended a csc meeting so do not know what Grothman said, I also dont know anything about there code or the secret handshake.
Dont lecture me on Integrity, for almost 25 years I have maintained my same client base , if I was a bum I doubt many would continue to do business with me. You collect your salary from the taxpayers,and regardless of performance will always have a free ride,then go online and advocate and be critical that we need to spend more or we should be taxed more , so you can continue your merry lifestyle and come back and beat us over the head for again more.In my book you advocate for yourself and your pocket at public expense.
The specific taxes you asked? it would be the school tax. You say we are not as high as the others , so does that mean we keep raising? Raise until they fold and move on?
Business and industry is long gone from West Bend, most here commute in order to work and afford a home. We all know the price of fuel and it will just get higher even more so now with the addition of the EPA or cap and tax, if local property taxes continue to climb to that of the cities they are commuting every day what would be the logic for living here? Would it not make more sense to just relocate .
Like I said we have already lost the industry, do you want the people to follow?
For the record I dont have time to lay on the couch and drink beer, call me ignorant but you will never call me out to slaughter with the rest of the sheep.And one more thing , You call them Owens selected snapshots but yet you spend alot of your time trying to dispute them or anybody here, . You getting paid for damage control? If its such a farce why not just giggle and move on.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 1733 hrs
Crusher,
Thank you for noting I only blog at lunch.
On your note “You collect your salary from the taxpayers,and regardless of performance will always have a free ride” - Untrue, I have a administrative team in my building who do not let that happen. Slackers can’t teach, they make everyone else’s job harder, and they must be replaced.
“...paid for damage control” - Nope.
“...giggle and move on” - Can’t.
If interested in more info on the coming oil issues, here’s a decent extreme site: http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/
The “breaking news” and several of the books are eye-opening.Thank you for the PRIDE, PERSONALITY and MEAT in your last post. I sincerely respect and appreciate it.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 2045 hrs
One thing is for sure… there will be no fall referendum.
Posted by Smeety on December 10, 2009 at 2131 hrs
It is interesting how you personally never stand up and speak in public. As I stated in my “Viewpoint”, it is easy to give opinions from the comfort of your closet.
The article gave a poor account of the CFAC meeting. The referendum was one of at least a dozen topics that were discussed. Unfortunately, it was a inexperienced reporter adding fuel to the fire. Just to let you know how meetings like these work, the group discusses topics that could be relevant to the financial issues of the District. As topics are discussed, many viewpoints are brought up, but when it comes down to making recommendations, they are based from a financial direction.
Regarding your comments about “hacks”, you don’t have a clue who I am and what I believe. You should look in a mirror.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 2143 hrs
Mark,
I know who you are. You are an arrogant advocate of the teachers.
‘Doesn’t get up and speak?’ ... give me a break. He’s one of the most effective bloggers in SE Wisconsin.
Posted by Smeety on December 10, 2009 at 2152 hrs
I have seen Owen on TV numerous times speaking his mind, looked like a studio to me not a closet.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 10, 2009 at 2336 hrs
I do know many of the members and the vast majority of them are basically hacks for the school district.
Not true. Perhaps some. Absence of any conflict of interest is tough in such a small town. It must simply be known.
But don’t we have one of our own on CFAC? Rich2 care to comment?Posted by Charlie Hillman on December 11, 2009 at 0124 hrs
Sure Charlie,
As Charlie alluded to, I am a new member of the CFAC committee. There are a couple of points here to address:
CFAC is a much more diverse group than I once thought. I wouldn’t put the tag school district hacks on anyone in the group. There are a couple of us who are on the more critical side of the discussion and there are a couple who’s opinions are aligned with the administration. The rest fill in the middle section. The opinions are generally wide-ranging. Personally, I would prefer there to be no conflict of interests (no family members, etc working for the district), but that is not always possible. As for the members, I cannot speak if any of them do have family at the District. I am unaware of anybody on the committee working for the district as well.
As for the Daily News article - my understanding, as I was NOT at the last meeting, is that it was not truly representative of the meeting. My guess is that the referendum piece was emphasized because of the issues that were discussed, it is the easiest to put into 1000 words and the easiest for the public to digest. My take on the referendum, and the one I shared in with the committee, is that I do not see the support for one. From what I have heard, that seems to be what many of the members thought as well. OPEB, maintenance budgets, General Fund need more than 1000 words to get right.
As a side note, since I was not at the meeting, I did NOT say the quote that was attributed to me. The Daily News printed a correction today. I do think their coverage of the last few meetings prior to this one, however, has been pretty accurate and fair.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 11, 2009 at 1856 hrs
Thanks Rich.
We need to make this work in West Bend. It just can’t be such an angry discussion. That helps nobody.
I have always held a skeptical view of operating referenda. Referenda are for capital projects. We certainly have enough need right there.
I agree that there is scant support for another referendum in these difficult economic times.
This too shall pass. We just need to hunker down. I agree with many of Mark Maley’s suggestions for long term structural changes aimed at cost savings.Posted by Charlie Hillman on December 11, 2009 at 1911 hrs
looking back at a November 25th post here on B & S, school declines land purchase, a teacher and Rich discuss attending a CFAC meeting and sitting next to each other. Something I am missing?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 11, 2009 at 2056 hrs
Crusher,
We were next to each other at the School Board work session that night. JPenterman is not on CFAC. I know we have (and don’t hold me to this) a lawyer, an IT nerd (that’s me), a purchasing manager, a stay-at-home mom, an engineer, the city recreation director and a couple others that are not teachers, but I don’t know their jobs.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 11, 2009 at 2124 hrs
Need more nerds!!
Posted by Charlie Hillman on December 11, 2009 at 2150 hrs
I can’t join CFAC if I could.
On Rich and Charlie, their posts have enabled me to further understand solutions to the school district’s budgetary woes. As I see it, the members of CFAC are volunteering their time to understand, analyze, and fix the district’s budget issues with the community brains involved and the community interests in mind. CFAC’s backgrounds, skepticism, questions and debates keep administration and the school board alert and in touch, which, for better or for worse, in the big picture, is in teachers’ interests. As to the teachers’, CFAC’s analyses, determinations and recommendations can affect them all ways, depending on the topic. I’m not writing this to gain favor (and it can’t, it won’t and it shouldn’t). It’s the big picture: CFAC is a sound, multi-faceted community organization that will enable big /difficult/ complicated decisions to be better made. Though I recommend bringing Popular Science and 4 other magazines to their meetings, the meetings are, for the most part, interesting.
Charlie is correct, CFAC can always use more brains: The geek shall inherit the earth.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 12, 2009 at 1025 hrs
If a committee is organized to provide financial advice to the district, it makes sense to me that they consider all financial options - including a referendum. That being said, if they talk about it and they can impact the decision of the school board, I want to know about it.
I don’t know how well-attended these CFAC meetings are, but I do know that if a crime is committed and there is no witness - all we have to rely on for the truth about what happened is the person who committed the crime. I’d rather not take CFAC members “word” for what goes on at their meetings.
Now that they are hearing from constituents just what we think about a referendum they have become another “victim” of the media. Convenient.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 21, 2009 at 2141 hrs
Where is the harm in asking a simple question? What do you fear?
I suspect that a lot of respondents to this topic fear that they will find themselves in the minority on this issue, and that the majority vote will raise everyone’s property tax. Sorry, people, but that’s how we do things in America.
A school board that really respects the community absolutely should allow the electors to exercise the powers given to them by the many laws. You can’t demand a seat at the decision-making table when it suits you while simultaneously decrying a similar offer to those who have different objectives and beliefs. Unless you’re in the US Congress, of course.
By the way, who all is running for the open School Board seats? or are you all just long on talk, and painfully obvious in the short on action category? The line starts behind the bloghost.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 31, 2009 at 1022 hrs
Frank,
Unfortunately in elections, especially local referendums and races, the “majority” is usually such a small percentage of the electors. It comes down to which side can mobilize their voters the most, weather, timing of the election, etc. Also, I am sure the numbers for and against a referendum will vary greatly between an April (no state races) or November (a high-profile state election for Governor) referendum. So while you suspect the majority will vote for it, I would think again.
As for action, I cannot squeeze in a School Board position at this time, but I asked and was accepted to the Citizen Financial Advisory Committee (CFAC) - allowing me to help shape some of the financial recommendations to the Board. I don’t always think that being a watchdog on issues automatically requires a person to run for office. The Peter Principle works for political office as it does in business.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on December 31, 2009 at 1323 hrs
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