West Bend Library Board Shuns Public Hearing Over Porn
This is troubling.
Dear Mr. and Mrs. Maziarka,
As of this time, the subject of the petition will not be on the May 5, 2009 Library Board meeting agenda. Our City Attorney, however, has notified the Board that they may still hold a special meeting to discuss the matter and respond to issues in the petitions or other related issues. That being said, the Board is not required to have such a meeting.
If the Board chooses to have a special meeting, that meeting will be duly posted and will be open to the public. The Board can allow public comment if it chooses to do so, but the Board is not required to do this.
Thank you.
Michael Tyree
Michael Tyree, Library Director
West Bend Community Memorial Library
630 Poplar Street
West Bend, WI 53095
Voice: 262-335-5151, ext. 125
FAX: 262-335-5150
I admit that I have been tepid on this movement. In the end, I have come down in favor of correctly classifying and locating these books, but not banning them. But this has become quite a significant issue in West Bend. For the library board to poo poo the notion of even having a meeting on the issue is disgraceful. The library is funded with taxpayer money. They have a responsibility to at least listen to the people who fund them. For the record, the library board is appointed by the Mayor and there is a meeting tomorrow evening regarding the appointees. The only way to put pressure on the library board is through the common council (a ridiculous scenario in my opinion).
Michael Tyree needs to be reigned in. While he may have no inclination to change library policies, he should at least take the concerns of the citizens into account.
Well, let me ask you this. Do you think Michael Tyree is unaware of the concern at this point? How many times does the issue have to be included on an agenda? How many times is he obligated to listen to the same people squawk at him about the same topic? Does he have to meet with the concerned parties every time they’d like to meet? How much time is he obligated to give them? Or at some point is he allowed to say “look, we get your concern, we disagree, there’s no point in discussing this ad nauseam when neither side is going to change their point of view”?
Reminds me of the days in the legislature when I’d have people that would call over and over again on the same issue. It got to the point where I would just send them the exact same letter I sent them the time before. I’d just change the date, sign it, and throw it in the out box, usually while they were still on the phone. The concern is registered. The legislator disagrees. Stop wasting everyone’s time.
If the Maziarkas want to lead a crusade to oust Tyree and/or the library board, more power to them. But really, everyone’s heard it by now. Time to find a new game plan or move on.
Posted by Recess Supervisor on April 20, 2009 at 2151 hrs
If I recall correctly, the issue has never been heard by the board. It was on the agenda for two meetings that were subsequently postponed. To date, the board has never heard these concerns in a public forum.
Posted by Owen on April 20, 2009 at 2155 hrs
Thanks for clarifying. That’s probably a reasonable expectation. I was of the impression that amidst all of the hullaballoo, the matter or some variant thereof was already addressed once. But that said, I’m not sure it needs to be entertained ad nauseam if the concerned parties are unhappy with the outcome.
Posted by Recess Supervisor on April 20, 2009 at 2204 hrs
There was a public meeting held by the Maziarkas, but that was not an official meeting.
Posted by Owen on April 20, 2009 at 2209 hrs
In short, we complied with following the libraries step-by-step policy of meeting first with the YA librarian, secondly with the library director, then with the board (but was cancelled). Then we had our complaint withdrawn unilaterally by the city attorney. We were told to start over. Ok, so we did. We are doing everything we were asked to do. Everything. We have not met again with the YA librarian, the director or the library board. So, in essence, we have had two meetings. Now this is where we are at. We tried to follow policy. We were not allowed to go further.
Posted by GAMazy on April 20, 2009 at 2217 hrs
Is somebody being forced to go down the porn aisle at the WB Library? Can’t they put it behind curtains like the X rated dvds at the video store? Don’t tread on my freedom! I might not make it to church every week but no one can take away my right to go if I want.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 20, 2009 at 2300 hrs
Re:Can’t they put it behind curtains like the X rated dvds at the video store?
As I understand the issue, that is exactly what the community wants, Along with a separate section “Why Porn is bad for you”.
It is using tax money to populate that second section of books that is sticking in the craw of the librarians.
What the Librarians do not understand is that there is a difference between censorship and withdrawing one patronage. Censorship is the using the coercive power of the government to confiscate privately owned books preventing the publication of some set of books. Withdrawing patronage is to refuse to buy or fund the purchase of books.
The taxpayers are trying to withdraw their patronage of purchasing additional porn and trying to patronize books with a counter point of view. You trying for that diversity thing so both sides of the issue can be told.
If the librarians are so determined to make these books available, then they can spend their own money can create a library open to the public of their own.
Posted by John Washburn on April 21, 2009 at 0257 hrs
Do we really want pedophiles and sex deviants roaming the same building as our children? I believe in the freedom of choice as much as anyone but those of you who have never experienced a pedophile approaching your child in a public library showing that child naked pictures in books found in that library dont have a clue. I went through it with my 10 year old daughter in Oconomowoc and had to call the police. Guess what? The library would not even provide the police with a list of books checked out in the time frame that happened so we could find out who that person was without a court order. The public library is supposed to be a safe place for children and not a place where the sick of mind can go to explore their sexual fantasy. You want porn? Well then put it in a place where children are not present. You want porn in the library? I bet you dont take your wife with you when you go look at it do you? The people have every right to vote on what they want in the library they pay for. Its always a few left fringe people that seem to ruin everything in our society.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0437 hrs
:zpopcorn:
Posted by Jed on April 21, 2009 at 0533 hrs
I love that letter from Tyree. Just a big ole “FU” to those nutty family values types running around West Bend. Here’s hoping that the old theatre on Main Street can be used for sex shows like they have in San Francisco. Our kids need to be exposed to these things otherwise they’ll never be ready to compete in the world.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0703 hrs
Jed, popcorn is not allowed in the library. Please take your noisy, crumbly snack food elsewhere.
Wait. Does it have gobs of butter on it?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0725 hrs
It never ceases to amaze me how common sense is so easily discarded in some issues. Unless my understanding of this issue is completely FUBAR, the basic issue here is that there are books with graphic content currently available in the children’s section of the library that citizens would like moved to a more appropriate section to ensure that young children are not exposed to it. Without making any judgement as to the literary value (or lack thereof) of this literature to teens approaching adulthood, it seems to me its a reasonable request. It seems to me that a parent should be able to take a child to the library, and allow them to peruse the books in the children’s section without having to provide direct supervision of each book they pull off the shelf to ensure it does not contain content that a parent might reasonable conclue is inappropriate for a child that age. When Librarians and Library boards become such obstructionists to even discussing such a proposal, I start to wonder what agenda these people really have, or alternatively, if they are just aren’t very bright to begin with. When I hear people start bandying about terms like book banning and censorship when all someone seems to be suggesting is MOVING the material to a different location within the library, I can’t help but wonder if these people have an ounce of common sense or perspective any where in their body? Seriously, WTF is wrong with these people?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0805 hrs
Here is a sampling of some of the excerpts of books that brought this to our attention, lest anyone think we are talking about hand-holding or kissing.
LIBRARY BOOK EXCERPTS
WARNING: This material is sexually explicit. Please remember this as you go forward with clicking on links.It’s perfectly normal : Can’t list the link here because I got the message that it is blacklisted for porn when I tried to do it. Go figure.
The Perks of Being a Wallflower: http://www.librarypatrons.org/book.asp?ID=56
Deal with it! : http://www.librarypatrons.org/book.asp?ID=24
Posted by GAMazy on April 21, 2009 at 0811 hrs
I haven’t really been paying attention to this at all, so I’m a little unclear on what’s going on. Is it really porn, or are you just using hyperbole to describe some book that talks about a blow job or something?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0827 hrs
The people have every right to vote on what they want in the library they pay for.
Actually they don’t really, they should, but they don’t. Just like I don’t (but should) have the right to cease paying the portion of my tax that funds libraries if I agree to never use the library.
If the library was a private institution, then you’d have much more of a say, simply by withholding your funding of the organization.
Posted by Matt on April 21, 2009 at 0835 hrs
Good Grief JIJAWM ... EVEN IF ‘its just a book talking about a BJ’ ... is it unreasonable for patrons with small children to want the book moved out of the children’s section of the library?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0837 hrs
I’ll join Jed in the corner… :zpopcorn:
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 0907 hrs
TD,
Of course it isn’t. I just wanted to know what we’re talking about. Since then, I read his last post and an article. My position is (1) It’s not porn and it’s pure hyperbole to call it porn, (2) It should be moved to a different section of the library.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 1113 hrs
As was previously stated in another thread, it should be noted that the “Deal With It” book, the “It’s Perfectly Normal” book and all YA non-fiction is not in the children’s section, it is already in the upstairs adult section of the library. Shelved with other adult books in the same categories according to the Dewey decimal system (ie sexuality) . The only way kids find those books is if they look them up in the search catalog and go upstairs looking for them.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 1650 hrs
TD-
To clarify in regards to the fiction YA books being talked about, they are not in the area where small children or most elementary students would be browsing. They are in a separate section, toward the back of the library and around the corner, meant for teens.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 1804 hrs
I have never seen a letter like that one from the library. It basically says go away. It basically says West Bend children will continue to be exposed to inappropriate material despite the law and common sense and there’s nothing anyone can do about it.
The library accepted a review under existing policy, then rejected it after it was already underway, and now refuses to discuss it. Perhaps it is time for judicial involvement for public employees who have exceeded their authority, among other things, and deprived citizens of redress under existing library policies.
Based on that letter from the library and the surrounding facts, if I were a judge, I would entertain a motion on an emergent basis for some sort of equitable relief. The letter is a polite way of saying the library refuses to address the issue further, and that appears at the very least to be a violation of the public trust, at least under the circumstances as I believe them to be.
Did you ever play Scrabble and get to the point where it’s impossible to make any words and you have to dump all the tiles and take new ones? Right now, West Bend’s got a losing hand at Scrabble.
Posted by Dan Kleinman on April 21, 2009 at 2214 hrs
If the board doesn’t even have to hear public comment, what’s stopping them from just holding a meeting, saying “thanks, but we’ll pass on moving the books” and just ending this all right now?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 2327 hrs
Michael Tyree is my new personal hero. Maybe that letter is a huge FU - it’s about time someone tried to “rein in” the crazies who have made this issue their personal crusade. I’ve followed this issue and I at first thought they were truly doing this out of an actual sense of community responsibility, but as time goes on, it just gets more mean-spirited. I guess you can’t stop a crusader once their righteousness has kicked in. Have you checked out her blog recently? Her glee over her pet issue pretty much getting several library board members kicked off the board? Is dividing a community ever a good idea? And good luck finding anyone to fill those spots on the board now!!! Who in their right mind would ever want to deal with this issue, or, frankly, a loon like her??? I agree with What, I wish the board would just kill this once and for all - oh wait, there’s no one left on the board.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 21, 2009 at 2345 hrs
Actually I think this issue would increase demand for those board seats. No one wants to sit on a “library board” as it is boring as heck, but this would certainly make it more fun.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 22, 2009 at 0956 hrs
wbrezz is right. good luck trying to find someone to sit on that board now. Have you noticed that crazy Ginny has not volunteered to be on the board? She never will. She just enjoys pissing and moaning from the cheap seats.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 22, 2009 at 1210 hrs
Like I said in today’s post, I think only City of West Bend residents can serve on the commissions - Ginny is Town of West Bend. Washington County has contracted with the library systems so that all county residents are served by libraries (this happened in the mid 80’s - before that date if you lived in certain areas of the county, you could not check out materials at the municipal libraries). Maybe Ginny should focus on getting the county to withdraw from the Mid-Wisconsin Federated Library System. Then parents of Town of West Bend children would not have to worry about “access” to those kinds of books. Of course, I don’t know how people in the rest of the county would take to not having library service, again.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on April 22, 2009 at 1303 hrs
I am shocked by this whole situation. It drives me crazy. The petitioners have whipped up the community and now they are trying to expand. Nobdy cares about the facts. Nobody cares about the law. The petitioners haven’t objected to BOOKS. They only point out sentences or paragraphs in books. Yor CAN’T DO THAT. In the Harmful Materials to Children Act it says THREE times that the material must be “taken as a whole” in defining pornography. When you only refer to short excerpts both the letter and spirit of the law is violated. Also—in determining what exactly porn is there are three more tests—Prodominant theme of the book must be prurient, is patyently offensive to the standards of the community AS A WHOLE ( and yes, you are a fringe group) the work lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific, or educational vale, TAKEN AS A WHOLE.
No books in the West Bend Public library fit that description.
When you cherry pick parts of a statute leaving out the rest you are deceiving the public. You are lying to them.
Let’s talk briefly about the Board. To say that the Library Board has stalled or delayed is a flat out lie. The Library Board has not made one decision, cast any votes regarding the scheduling of any meeting. If any one had the decency to ask (and nobody does) both adjournments of the issue were ordered by the City Attorney, Mary Schanning. One meeting was canceled by the absolute mandate of the Wisconsin Open Meetings Law. To proceed would have been a violation. The Board didn’t delay anything. At its next meeting (next week) the Board will take up the issue of a special meeting. There will be a meeting of some sort. But it won’t be the public frenzy that the Maziarkas’s want.
I could go on again about the City Council decision but my experience has been that you people don’t care about facts—or about the truth. I’ll save it for another day.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on May 01, 2009 at 1348 hrs
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