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Fugetaboutit

There we go...

The foreign minister of Russia said Thursday that Georgia could “forget about” getting back its two breakaway provinces, and the former Soviet republic remained on edge as Russia sent tank columns to search out and destroy Georgian military equipment.

Russia’s intent was never anything more or less than an outright seizure of territory.

Posted by Owen at 2124 hrs
Foreign Affairs

1. So what are we going to do about it?

   Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on August 15, 2008 at 0631 hrs
   
   
   

2. The US provided the example for this, allowing Kosovo to carve itself out of Serbia and then recognizing that, despite a serious violation of the typical protocols.  Because of that, the West can hardly demand that S Ossetia be a part of Georgia—it’s a contradiction of principles (such as they are.)

   ASSUMING that The Bear doesn’t want anything more than S. Ossetia, the pressure should be maintained for a couple of things:  1)  guarantees of Georgia’s integrity (minus S Ossetia) and 2)  some semblance of ‘democracy’ in S. Ossetia; and 3)  ‘under-the-table’ promises of The Bear’s assistance in fighting Muslim radicalism—whether in Iran or elsewhere.

   But this should be European/US joint pressure, not US alone.  The pipeline is Europe’s problem, not ours, and the US does not have the military capability needed to pull S Ossetia back into Georgia, even if S Ossetians WANTED that.

   Also under-the-table, the current Pres. of Georgia should be put out to pasture.

   Posted by dad29 on August 15, 2008 at 0700 hrs
   
   
   

3. Dad29- You are comparing apples and oranges here:

   1. Russia wants to absorb these two provinces, Albania does not want Kosovo.

   2. The Russian minorities in these two provinces are relative newcomers, Kosovo has historically been ethnically Albanian.

   3. There was no “independence”, and I use that term here very loosely, in Georgia until Russia encouraged it a few years ago.  There has been tension in Kosovo since what seems like the beginning of time.

   4. Russia invaded Georgia territory, while no outside country invaded Kosovo.

   Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on August 15, 2008 at 0920 hrs
   
   
   

4. Really?

   It makes no difference whether “Albania wants” Kosovo—they are independent of Serbia—which IS the point, not Albania.

   Actually, Ossetia is occupied by Ossetians—which are NOT Georgians, nor Russians.  Sorta like Kosavars are not Serbs, nor Croats, (nor really Albans.)

   Russia invaded Georgia AFTER Georgia started shelling Ossetia.  The twit-in-charge of Georgia was feeling oats which were not actually his.

   Posted by dad29 on August 15, 2008 at 1237 hrs
   
   
   

5. Ossetia has a majority Russian ethnic population.  Kosavo is a majority Albanian population.  Seriously, if you are going to make this argument get your facts right. 

   Getting back to your point, you cannot compare the two because they are different situations.  Find another example to make your argument.

   Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on August 15, 2008 at 1404 hrs
   
   
   

6. Right.  They’re different.

   That’s why several prominent authors on the topic (not me, fella!!) have compared them directly.

   You say Ossetians are Russians.  Only by citizenship, not ethnicity—although there are a number of Russkis in there now.  But Ossetians are NOT Russians.  (HINT: That’s why it’s called “Ossetia.”  Kinda like why Afghans inhabit Afghanistan.)

   As to the ethnicity of Kosovars—you’re right, they’re Albans.

   SO WHAT?

   My point stands:  they declared independence from Serbia, just like the Ossetians wish to declare independence from Georgia.  WE blessed their independence (both Clinton and Bush.)  The Russians simply are playing tit-for-tat by helping the Ossetians become independent of Georgia.

   You’d best learn to read.

   Posted by dad29 on August 15, 2008 at 1730 hrs
   
   
   

7. No, Russia wants to absorb both provinces into Russia.  You seriously have no idea what is going on do you?  If you are going to shill for Russia you need to move beyond just a couple websites and actually read what has been going on since the break up of the Soviet Union.  The Caucuses are extremely complicated.

   Oh, and I notice you did not post my comment on your blog pointing here.

   Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on August 16, 2008 at 1556 hrs
   
   
   

8. Umnnnhnhh…John, I’m not Blogger.  I don’t “not-post”, pointing or not.  And I don’t remove posts unless they are excessively crude.

   Call Google and complain.

   I’m sure that you can document your claim that “Russia wants absorb both provinces back.”

   Finally, I’m not ‘shilling for Russia.’  My position is simple:  there are problems in this world that the US military should not address.  This happens to be a Europe-problem.  About time that Europe grew a spine.

   Recall, John, that when BillyBoy Clinton decided to interfere in Serbia, all the real Conservatives derided his “globo-cop” crap. 

   I haven’t changed my position.  Have you?

   Face it:  Bush and Rice fell asleep at the switch here.  Instead of controlling Georgia, they let that wacko-with-a-suit smack The Bear across the chops.  Now he expects us to bail him out.

   You think the US is a Globo-Cop?  You’re wrong.  The Constitution was not written to protect Georgia, nor Uzbekhistan, nor for that matter, Poland.

   Now either come up with a Compelling National Interest or just back off.

   Posted by dad29 on August 16, 2008 at 1940 hrs
   
   
   

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