Different Format for March 22nd School Board Meeting
Hmmmm…. where have I seen something like this before?
The third presentation of the 2010-11 proposed budget recommendations will be at the March 22 board meeting. District administrators and school board members have indicated they would like to see a large audience.
The purpose of the School Board meeting, according to Ted Neitzke,, assistant superintendent of curriculum and instruction, is to increase the community’s awareness of the school district’s budget — past, present and future — and to collect community feedback.
Because the focus of the meeting is on collecting feedback, the format will be different than a typical board meeting, Neitzke said.
The evening will begin with a budget presentation by Neitzke. After the presentation, community members will be split into large groups and put into classrooms. The size of the groups, Neitzke said, would depend upon attendance.
If 300 people attended the meeting, for example, they would be divided into groups of 30 in 10 classrooms.
Within the classrooms, people will be further divided into groups of five to six people Neitzke said.
The small “focus” groups would be asked to provide feedback on a number of budget related issues. Feedback would then be collected by a facilitator and brought back to the school board.
“The changed format will give the most people the most opportunities to have their voices heard,” Neitzke said. “Our district is very unique. There is no other school board in the state that is going out this early to ensure that the community understands the budget.”
Ah yes, I remember now. It’s a variation of the Delphi Technique used by liberal activists for decades to build faux consensus. I don’t like this format for a variety of reasons. First, there is the opening for manipulation of the results. If all of the groups are divided up and the administrator comes back and says “the majority did not want to cut X from the budget,” who can dispute it? If your group was OK with cutting X, how do you know what the other groups thought about it? How can you verify the administrator’s statement? You can’t.
Second, it is a process designed to exclude all but the most committed. If it were a regular board meeting, then I could go and listen to the budget presentation, perhaps say my piece, and then leave if I have other commitments. This format forces all attendees to commit to the evening. That means that the passively interested won’t bother to attend because they don’t want to commit to the time and the folks with the most to lose or gain will dominate the process. Who will be the most likely to take an entire evening to attend? Take a guess.
Third, this process filters the ideas that will boil up for the board to hear, and the filter will be applied by the school administration. For example, if someone in Group #6 has a great idea that nobody else thought of, the board may never hear it because it didn’t develop into a “theme.” Or if a theme develops of people saying “cut 10% of administration” and the administration considers that “unworkable,” then the input may be excluded from the final results.
This method is a tried and true method to give the facilitators maximum control over the flow of information. How they use that control should be of great concern to the citizens in this school district.
One more thing… the Superintendent is up for review this month. Odds are about 20,000 to 1 that she will receive a raise.
Does it really matter. No matter what is said the school board will continue to TAX to THE MAX. Who wouldn’t want as much money as they can possible collect. They could take everyones property and sell it and they still won’t have enough money. This is all for show.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 10, 2010 at 1103 hrs
Another horse and pony show,let me predict they will say the majority of people they talked with encourage raising taxes to keep current programing.
Figure on every year a tax raise coming to cover operating expenses, and toss in another building ref. It is by all means a bottomless pit, the only way to defeat this thing is elect new board members and start turning this runaway train in another direction.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 10, 2010 at 1314 hrs
At the beginning of the school year millions of dollars in cuts were suggested due to budget shortfalls, correct?
Since then we have been funneling the choices down to the $2MM in cuts needed, correct?
The School Board has finally identified the $2MM it expects to cut, there are no more options, correct?
So, what am I missing? Why are we wasting all this time? If there are no more options, make the cuts and move on…
I don’t WANT to see gifted and talented programs cut, I don’t WANT to see our social workers cut, and we can all go to the microphone and state just that…
Is there some other alternative out there that is not spoken? What are we waiting for?
On an aside, please let me know when the meeting will start. I am not there for entertainment so when I show up 15 minutes late please be sure to save a spot in a group for me.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 10, 2010 at 1340 hrs
Crusher, thank you for the compliment in the last post.
Mr. Robinson,
This meeting’s community agenda is a variation of the process based budgeting (PBB) approach that the district used for 3-4 years during the budget building process to prepare for possible variations in the amount of state education funding. It was used for one or two years with the superintendent prior to Dr. Herdrich and one or two years under Herdrich (Memory fails). Under the PBB model, parents, teachers and administrators would go to the various buildings 3-5 times over a couple months at the year’s start, be given a list of items/staff to cut in that specific building’s budget, and through large and small group discussion arrive at what needed to be cut to meet 3-4 budget situations. I participated every year. The teachers eventually opted out when the concept of recommending laying off staff positions became unbearable (Rationale: Administrators are paid to make these decisions.). 1) There were always limitations of what could be cut: above the line, below the line. 2) The same people came every year and/or newbies had to be educated. The positive side of such tactics is that participants (community members and teachers) get a true sense of the complexity of school budget building/reducing. As you stated, “this process filters the ideas that will boil up for the board to hear”.This process never lent any “great ideas” because the wiggle room was so small. However, if at this 3/22 meeting someone suggested 10% of the administrators be cut, there would be knowledgeable people there to inform committed community participants the ramifications of such a recommendation; for example, by providing job descriptions of admin positions proposed to be cut.
The administrators did steer groups’ discussions, but a committed group of people could get their recommendations through to the board if they had consensus, even if the recommendations were counter to the supervising administrator’s interests. Commitment and clear/sound/informed argument trump all.
The individuals screaming, “tax to the max” or “no new taxes” and then leaving, contribute little to this complicated problem’s solution. Organized, committed, informed people get things done reasonably right without often regrettable unthoughtful decisions.
To some degree, new and old board members and administrators (and many other (conservative) organizations) annually participate in this “Delphi Technique” “horse and pony show” “used by liberal activists”.
Mr. Robinson, your foreboding tone tainting your cynical/pessimistic position towards the district attempting to encourage organized, civil, community activism in school budget decision making is unsurprising, but you just get back to your Little House on the Prairie and Harry Callahan DVDs.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 10, 2010 at 2303 hrs
This is a clear in indication that this board has already chosen it’s direction. Similar to having the slimy school referendum in the spring instead of the fall; similar to paying no mind to Badger crowd. This board has no leadership. ‘Let’s ask our employees if we need to cut staff?’ .... great idea ...
The board already has it’s mind made up. TAX TO THE MAX!!!! This is just a weak effort @ damage control.
IGNORED BY THE BOARD!!!! should be the motto of the unemployed, the taxpayers (the stakeholders that appear to be left out of this thought process)....
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 10, 2010 at 2333 hrs
Jason,
You type a lot, but never actually refute any of my points. But you just get back to your My Little Pony DVDs
Posted by Owen on March 10, 2010 at 2336 hrs
Here’s a lesson from the real world…
My company had a difficult 2009 like everyone else. We had to implement a hiring freeze. Yet the workload increased roughly 15%, though at much slimmer margins. You know what we found out? There was fat. The same number of people could do 15% more work at equal quality for the same wages. Part of this is because we have great people, but another part is that when you have to truly, REALLY, prioritize, the BS falls away.
The school district has never really had to force its employees to focus because it has the ability to increase revenue with the force of law. I agree with an earlier commenter… cut 10% of administration right now. Tell the remaining folks to work harder. Period. Welcome to real life.
Posted by Owen on March 10, 2010 at 2350 hrs
While I appreciate the opportunity the public has to give input about the budget, I wonder about the board’s sincerity in listening to what the public wants. Remember last fall? Many expressed concern about a tax hike and asked the board to consider their wishes,(in an open, public setting) yet the entire board voted to raise our taxes.
The discussion about this budget was done back in January. I attended a meeting at the high school where the budget cuts were presented and those in attendance had opportunity to speak. It was well done, it and done in openness.
I too feel that this tactic by the board is manipulative. Whether done purposely or not, I don’t know, but I am concerned that the public’s sentiments will be heard in private and not in an open, public setting.
I wonder if they ever intended to actually make any cuts. We are hearing about an operating referendum, something that has been brought up in the past and is now being brought up again.
I applaud the principals and teachers for coming up with the cuts they are proposing. There are services the county offers that can be cut from the school budget, and other redundant and unnecessary positions. There have been some good ideas presented. Why not allow a true public discussion about this?As far as Gifted and Talented goes, why not look into more virtual offerings? Of course the details need to be worked out, but it has possibilities. If we need to cut a teacher or change from full to part-time, why not use some technology to keep the program going at a fraction of the cost? Just a thought.
Dave Weigand
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 0840 hrs
I have facilitated these types of meetings more than once. Near the end of the meeting the facilitator gets the group to prioritize the ideas for follow up or consensus that an idea shouldn’t be pursued at this time. The group sets the priority.
‘Management’ may decide to not follow any of the ideas, however, they are on record and management can later be asked why ideas weren’t used. The good ones provide a compilation from each group listing all ideas which were presented. Each group also makes a very short presentation back to the whole group on what the key consensus ideas were. Without that immediate follow up and communication, the whole process too open for internal manipulation.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 0906 hrs
So, i have a sincere question. For those of you that are critical of the idea of a different format and have talked about how bad it will be. Do you think the board should cancel the idea and not have any listening session? Also, if they still have the night as scheduled will you attend?
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1053 hrs
Do you think the board should cancel the idea and not have any listening session?
False choice. I think they should cancel the planned format and have a true open listening session.
Also, if they still have the night as scheduled will you attend?
As of now, I am planning to attend irrespective of the format.
Posted by Owen on March 11, 2010 at 1057 hrs
In my experience smaller groups work better. In larger groups the negative and positive crowds can get momentum and overwhelm the other side. I think they have a good plan as long as they listen to all of the ideas and give them to the board.
When a group is not facilitated then you can lose the focus and that ends up being a waste of time.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1119 hrs
Joe’s already said he’ll paint us a picture of what 2 mil in cuts looks like, guess where this is going again?? Joe and Pat have already set the stage to come after us for (Again) for that 2 million, and the other Board Members will tow the line.
Not one Board Member can stand up and say enough is enough? Let’s take a look……..
OK, we know Joe and Pat sure won’t, (hell would freeze over first)
Kris? (OK, that’s just plain funny!),
Lynn, Kathy and Bruce? (yea right)
Tim and Todd? (slight maybe, but Joe will take’em to the wood shed) so no.Have you ever been in a room with a group that agrees on every single thing like this Board does? Curious…
So their going to rally their Teacher Buddies (Again) and scream at us how awful it will be if they don’t TAX TO THE MAX! Easier for them, and keeps their buddies happy too!
Anyway, that leaves me with going to “Joe’s Circus and Puppet Show” (Again) like last year, or saving it for the Booth.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1343 hrs
TTTM,
What is it like to be such a complete douche? Yes you are and you know it.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1357 hrs
Anon-” When a group is not facilitated then you can lose the focus and that ends up being a waste of time.”
Anon, are you into Mind Control?- Is that “For the Kids”?
I’ll bet you and your Big Thinker Teacher Buddies will keep your groups
focused.Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1428 hrs
In regards to #7
Does anyone remember when the superintendent quit and his assn’t and a secretary took over his duties for the remander of the year. Well they both needed a big raise to do this “because you could not expect them to do more work for the same pay” This is not the Real World !Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 1626 hrs
Keep voting, it appears to be working.
Posted by .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address) on March 11, 2010 at 2155 hrs
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